Racing for 5th - Ponder this

[Rollo]

Hypothetically speaking, if you were Lewis Hamilton would you drive all out and perhaps risk a World Championship or would you take it safe and try to just score a 5th or better?

Massa needs to shoot for either 1st or 2nd to even have a shot at it, so he'll be quite rightly throwing everything he possibly can at the title. So taking that as rote, is it wiser for Lewis to drive a more sensible race and try to come 4th or 5th and thus avoid coming into contact with the Ferrari?

If you consider Kimi could be floating around somewhere, would he consider having an "accident" if the situation arose to help out Massa?

I think that we could have quite a delicious set of tactics that could be played out in Brazil.

[Valve Bounce]

I think the best plan would be for Lewis to follow the two Ferraris around the circuit, and if Fonzo wants to pass, then let him. I don't think any of the others will have the pace of the McLaren to worry him.

[PSfan]

Is Hamilton capable of watching the Ferrari's in front, and not racing them? He doesn't strike me as the sit back and let things happen kind of guy, more so, there is just as much chance of getting in a tangle in 5th to 8th place as there is leading the race.

Also, if Kimi was the kinda driver that could crash out someone else, he had the prime opportunity in Japan (And Hamilton would have gotten the blame for it too) and didn't take it... I think Ferrari's biggest mistake in China was not putting Kimi on a lighter fuel load and getting him in front of Hamilton, and tempting him to make a mistake.


Was also checking over this seasons stats... so far Hamilton has 1 more points scoring finish over Massa, also there hasn't been a race this year where both Massa and Hamilton failed to score points...

[Tazio]

I think the best plan would be for Lewis to follow the two Ferraris around the circuit, and if Fonzo wants to pass, then let him. I don't think any of the others will have the pace of the McLaren to worry him.That's all well and good! But if it falls that way Lewis will want HK as a tail-gunner. That will be a give-away of the WCC! Plus you are still risking some one like Sea Bass punting Hk out of the park at T1. This will give
SV, JT, Junior, NH, and Saint Kubica pot shots at Lewis if he has the Ferraris ahead of him with Kimi tail gunning for Massa. He could conceivably hold up Lewis enough to facilitate a barrage from this list of antagonists. Lewis will be best severed to try to qualify on the front row go for the lead but not with an "all costs" attitude. I think this is a more likely scenario, because it kills two birds with one stone! (You can bet RD could use the WCC booty)
Just think, if Lewis' first pit stop is out of P3, 4, or 5 he would be likely to rejoin between a couple of one stoppers like Sponge Bob, and some other dork!
Plus:
"Homey don't play dat"! :p :

[Hawkmoon]

I know what I'd do but I doubt Hamilton feels the same way. Afterall, didn't ol' Ron tell Hamilton to take it easy and not race Raikkonen in Japan? Turned out well, that did.

If the Ferrari has a clear speed advantage at Interlagos then I think Hamilton will settle for 3rd. If the cars are evenly matched then I think he'll fight it out for the win. The past two seasons haven't given us any reason to think otherwise.

[truefan72]

fight like hell for pole, get a clean start and then let the chips fall where they may. If he starts 2nd, 4rd or 4th I'll be happy. I just don;t want any first corner problems that's all.

My big question mark here is Massa. How aggressive is he going to be if he doesn't start from pole. We saw how he drove in Japan and I fear if He is behind LH he will try to tangle with him.

My best scenario would be Heikke starting from pole and controlling the pace for a while with LH comfortably in 4th. Let the 2 ferrari's duke it out in between and he can watch them all race long, then if he needs to get by Kovy then it will happen.

The only dark horse is Alonso.He may be awfully quick in Brazil, but we will see.

[Mifune]

has to approach it as a normal weekend and let the chips fall where they may, changing mindset would be inadvisable,
Schumacher only needed 8th in 2003 and his weekend turned into a total clusterf^&k, he being paradoxically the kind of driver who drives like a pudding when the pressure is off. in the end he was very lucky to get points he needed.

Hamilton has the tendency,(understandably given his youth and inexperience) to screw up every 4th weekend or so, he should just take this as a normal weekend and ride his luck. that should be enough.

[harvick#1]

2007 ring a bell ;)

Lewis went crazy when Alonso passed him and he went off course on lap 1. if hes smart enough, he would just ride in third behind the 2 ferraris

Massa in a Ferrari has been pretty untouchable in Brazil, so I see Felipe on Pole and Kimi qualifing P2.


now if Alonso starts behind Hamilton, some sparks could fly, but I can't see Alonso being that stupid to cream into the back of someone on lap 1 because of dislike

[markabilly]

Hypothetically speaking, if you were Lewis Hamilton would you drive all out and perhaps risk a World Championship or would you take it safe and try to just score a 5th or better?

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If I was Lewie, hypothetically speaking, I would try to avoid putting it in neutral by pushing the wrong button in middle of the first lap.......




but that is just me hypothetically speaking...... :rolleyes:

[gravity]

Well... put it this way;
who would u rather be as we head off to Brazil... Massa or Lewis?
I reckon Lewis has a whole load more options than Massa. You ask what Lewis will do if he has the opportunity to race the Ferrari's? I ask what Massa will do if he finds himself in the middle of a fight for position. He cannot afford to make a mistake and cannot afford not to make the pass. The pressure will be on for both drivers. A little more pressure on Massa than Lewis though.

[wmcot]

With a 12 point lead over Kubica, Massa doesn't have a lot to lose. He can risk everything if he needs to. However, Lewis doesn't seem to be able to sit back and cruise to the championship. Perhaps Ron will spend the next 2 weeks trying to de-program Lewis' thinking in the race car?

[F1boat]

IMO he will try to get a Pole-position and win, because if you lead, chances are that you won't be hit in a battle for position. But if one or both Ferrari cars, or them + Alonso, are faster, he should let them. He has nothing to win in such battle.

[CaptainRaiden]

Massa in a Ferrari has been pretty untouchable in Brazil, so I see Felipe on Pole and Kimi qualifing P2.

I don't think it's pretty much THAT straightforward. Interlagos requires more mechanical grip, and the Mclaren seems to be much better in that area right now.

I think the Mclaren would be the faster car at Brazil, but I'm not predicting anything yet. ;)

[Dave B]

All he's got to do is drive a normal race, given that by his standards "normal" means a podium finish.

If he tries too hard to deliberately change his mindset that's when he's most likely to make a mistake.

Realistically who has the pace to beat him in a straight fight right now? Both Ferraris, Alonso, Kubica and... nope that's about all. Even with those four gentlemen in front of him Hamilton would still be champion :champion:

[Mark]

He'll be trying to win the race of course. As the easiest way to get the result he needs is to start on pole, and lead every lap!

[pino]

Lewis is a "wild horse" you can't tell him, go there, put yourself in 5th pos and keep it for the whole race no matter what. No he needs to go there and race like he did in all races so far, with his talent and a bit luck the title will be his. I don't think we will se the same movie we saw last year...

[Bezza]

The Ferrari's will undoubtedly be quick in Brazil.

There are a couple of situations that could arise:

Raikkonen colliding with Hamilton. Unlikely in my opinion, he is not that kind of driver.

Alonso colliding with Hamilton. Well he said he would help Massa...and is not driving for anything and is a law unto himself.

Hamilton colliding with Massa. Should he get near Massa, he may collide with him - thinking that somebody (Raikkonen, Alonso) may collide with him and take him out on purpose...

Kovalainen colliding with Massa. Expect Kovy to be fuelled light to get in the mix at the start at least.

Anybody else colliding with Hamilton. Judging by drivers not being impressed by Hamilton's driving standards and ego, they may take it out on him where it really hurts.



At China, nobody got near him - but I doubt the same level performance in Brazil, and we're in for a treat.

[ArrowsFA1]

I think Lewis simply (oh, it's so easy :laugh: ) has to aim to reproduce his Chinese GP performance. The moment he thinks in terms of a 5th placed finish then he could find himself embroiled in an upper-midfield scrap, stuck behind a slower car and having to take risks.

Far better, as Mark said, to start on pole, and lead every lap!

[SGWilko]

For the past couple of seasons the Ferrari has been the car to beat at Interlagos, I don't see any reason why that would change this season.

I would say that the two Ferrari's will run off into the sunset, with Lewis coming in third.

There is no point trundling round in 5th, what if you get a puncture?

So, if the McLaren is fast, fine, take the win, if not, play it safe to finish as high as possible without taking silly risks.

[jens]

The interesting thing is that at the moment Hamilton has exactly the same advantage (7pts) over Massa as he had last year over Räikkönen. The same 5th place was needed to secure the WDC.

Before the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix we were discussing exactly about the same thing - that Lewis should play it safe and the title is comfortably his. You saw, what happened. I think considering Hamilton's hotheadidness this WDC fight is far from over - somehow those theoretical calculations a'la "he should calmly sit in P5" count for nothing, when he starts racing... I am concerned, TBH. Funny. Exactly the same situation a year later. Take 2.

[ioan]

It's a piece of cake for Lewis now, and I suppose that RD will be smart enough not to push him to fight for the constructors championship points where Ferrari leads by 11 points anyway.

[longisland]

Considering what happened last year, I doubt Ron's will let history repeat itself. The challenge to have Lewis levelheaded enough not to race Massa and avoid any incidents. The game plan is simple, grab the pole and run away like they did in China.

[wedge]

It's a piece of cake for Lewis now, and I suppose that RD will be smart enough not to push him to fight for the constructors championship points where Ferrari leads by 11 points anyway.

I'm surprised by you remark! You sound like a defeated Ferrari fan!

It's not as easy as it sounds. The win in China was 1 step closer to WDC for Lewis.

All Lewis needs to do is a solid result by bringing the car home by staying out of trouble.

I was just thinking about Nicolas Minassian at the last LMS where he lost the title because of a contretemps with a backmarker and scored a DNF despite dominating the championship.

Massa needs a win and DNF from Hamilton. I think there's still a WDC up for grabs for Massa.

[ioan]

I'm just being realistic about the chances.
Massa had his biggest chance in Singapore but the team managed to throw it away in a royal way. Them saying that all they need was three 1-2 finishes was laughable given the current competitiveness of the field.
Ferrari has a good chance to walk away with the WCC title and try again next season.
To win the WDC they need a miracle, IMO.

[jens]

But that "miracle" happened a year ago... ;)

[F1boat]

I'm just being realistic about the chances.
Massa had his biggest chance in Singapore but the team managed to throw it away in a royal way. Them saying that all they need was three 1-2 finishes was laughable given the current competitiveness of the field.
Ferrari has a good chance to walk away with the WCC title and try again next season.
To win the WDC they need a miracle, IMO.

I will be happy if they win the WCC, however. I am not calm however, after Singapore, I can't be.

[pettersolberg29]

Who could beat him?

Massa and Kimi are probably gonna get 1-2 bar any problems.

Kubica could get ahead, Alonso might.

Heidfeld may if he qualifies high, same with Vettel or Trulli.

So I think he really has to go for it - not on the limit, but as close as possible as he doesn't want to end up scrapping for 5th with Nick and Jarno.

[Sleeper]

I would like to see him just go for it.

[Knock-on]

Fuel Heikki light to try and get him on pole.

Give Lewis a few laps eqtra and turn down the engine a bit after the first couple of qualifying laps and short shift.

Heikki slows the field, Lewis takes the lead after the pit stops and everythings great until the after race penalty.

[wmcot]

Hamilton colliding with Massa. Should he get near Massa, he may collide with him - thinking that somebody (Raikkonen, Alonso) may collide with him and take him out on purpose...


Your logic is mind blowing! :)

[Hawkmoon]

Heikki slows the field, Lewis takes the lead after the pit stops and everythings great until the after race penalty.

Followed by McLaren's "request for clarification" appeal on whether the coffee in the Ferrari hospitality tent was within the acceptable temperature range. ;)

[wmcot]

Lewis is a "wild horse" you can't tell him, go there, put yourself in 5th pos and keep it for the whole race no matter what. No he needs to go there and race like he did in all races so far, with his talent and a bit luck the title will be his. I don't think we will se the same movie we saw last year...



Pretty much my same thoughts on Lewis "settling" for 5th. I think he would have an empty feeling winning the WDC that way. Expecting him to race (with the possibility of a mistake) makes the last race of the season seem more exciting (now let's hope it will be!)

[keysersoze]

McLaren need to see how things play out during practice and qualifying, and be prepared to run up front. If they are close, fuel both cars light, control the start, and have Kovalainen slow up the Ferraris while Lewis builds up a sizable lead.

If Ferrari looks like it will be too quick, it's still important for Heike to be near Hamilton, to keep Alonso at bay. Fernando is the real concern here and I can see him fueling light in order to stay in the mix. He REALLY doesn't want Lewis to win.

On the other hand, Kimi couldn't give a toss if Massa wins. Fortunately, he is no Senna (neither is Alonso), so I think everyone will behave themselves at the start.

[woody2goody]

McLaren need to see how things play out during practice and qualifying, and be prepared to run up front. If they are close, fuel both cars light, control the start, and have Kovalainen slow up the Ferraris while Lewis builds up a sizable lead.

If Ferrari looks like it will be too quick, it's still important for Heike to be near Hamilton, to keep Alonso at bay. Fernando is the real concern here and I can see him fueling light in order to stay in the mix. He REALLY doesn't want Lewis to win.

On the other hand, Kimi couldn't give a toss if Massa wins. Fortunately, he is no Senna (neither is Alonso), so I think everyone will behave themselves at the start.

So there is definitely still tension between Fernando and Lewis despite various people playing it down?

Funny how Fernando's up at the front again when Lewis needs to take the title :) It's going to be a super race and actually I wouldn't bet against Alonso winning at Interlagos.

[Valve Bounce]

Lewis is a "wild horse" you can't tell him, go there, put yourself in 5th pos and keep it for the whole race no matter what. No he needs to go there and race like he did in all races so far, with his talent and a bit luck the title will be his. I don't think we will se the same movie we saw last year...

I don't think he should be stupid again like he was in Japan - that didn't help.

[Valve Bounce]

Funny how Fernando's up at the front again when Lewis needs to take the title :) It's going to be a super race and actually I wouldn't bet against Alonso winning at Interlagos.

Care to bet your sig on it? I'll back Felipe against Fonzo! :p :

[Tazio]

So there is definitely still tension between Fernando.Woodster you can't say something is definitive with a forum member’s opinion as reference :dozey:
Fred and Lewis will have an adversarial relationship for the rest of their f1 careers. (Even when they're both driving for Ferrari) :p :
They are both too absurdly rich and adored by their respective fans to have it mean any more than that! Let's stay away from the tabloid aspect of this race. There are other pilots that have their own adversaries. Those however simply don't sell fish-wraps!
Sponge Bob alone has to have a box full. :laugh:




Funny how Fernando's up at the front again when Lewis needs to take the title :) It's going to be a super race and actually I wouldn't bet against Alonso winning at Interlagos.If it's not a first race engine in Freds car It better be really wet, because both Ferraris are on race one engines!
That, or a lot of carnage! :) Actually I'd love to see it, but Ferrari want that WCC also. They definately have something to lose in this race beside the WDC

[Valve Bounce]

Ferrari 1-2 coming up!!