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View Full Version : Spa-Francorchamps Thread! (Practice, Qualifying, and GP)



gloomyDAY
4th September 2008, 16:31
The weather! Rain all weekend long?

I'm waiting to see how the power differences will reflect on this track.
For some reason, can't quite put my finger on it :D , I think Kimi will win.

Valve Bounce
5th September 2008, 03:23
The weather! Rain all weekend long?

I'm waiting to see how the power differences will reflect on this track.
For some reason, can't quite put my finger on it :D , I think Kimi will win.

OK, here is the link for the weather in case anyone wants to have a look.
http://www.trackpedia.com/wiki/Spa_Francorchamps#Weather_Forecast
Because the track is spread out over quite some distance, it is quite possible that it could actually rain over some parts of the track and not others during the race. Now!! :eek: that would make for some interesting tyre strategies and even spectacular racing.

I do remember one start at Spa in very wet conditions where there was one almighty prang at the first corner; anyone remember that?

Valve Bounce
5th September 2008, 03:47
I'm actually looking at Stavelot through Google Earth. I don't see any cars moving :(

ioan
5th September 2008, 07:44
I do remember one start at Spa in very wet conditions where there was one almighty prang at the first corner; anyone remember that?

1998 (I think), all but the first 2 cars or so were involved in that crash. Luckily back than T-cars were allowed in F1.

Ranger
5th September 2008, 08:04
1998 (I think), all but the first 2 cars or so were involved in that crash. Luckily back than T-cars were allowed in F1.

That has to be one of the most extraordinary races in the past 20 years of F1. Although it was a bit less than that, 13 cars were involved/written off, with several teams having both cars wiped out. Nowadays of course that part of the track is as wide as a runway so something nearly as interesting won't happen.

gloomyDAY
5th September 2008, 08:45
I remember Spa '98 made the news in America.

This was my first glimpse (http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=XfO9JM_U2D0&feature=related) of Formula 1 as a kid in middle school.

ShiftingGears
5th September 2008, 08:54
I don't think that the weather, as predicted, will play into Massa's hands at all.

ioan
5th September 2008, 10:21
Track is very green and slippery, everyone going sideways and making lots of mistakes, also some incredible saves!

ioan
5th September 2008, 10:41
Red Bull and DC talking about the rain coming earlier than expected.

ioan
5th September 2008, 10:53
BMW are looking very bad, for now at least.

ioan
5th September 2008, 10:59
Lewy trying the offroad setup!

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:08
Kubica making his engineer look like an idiot. Something along the lines.

Engineer: "We'll put option tires on, they are certainly faster. It seems that the prime tires aren't working with these track conditions."

Kubica: "Option tires will be better but no one else is running option tires out there, our car doesn't have grip and balance, it doesn't work."

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:09
Those Honda engines sound like lacking power, lots of it.

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:09
WTH is everyone? I can't believe it no one is watching the seasons best GP week end.

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:10
Lewy decides to go the BMW way to try to top the time sheets, option tires all the way.

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:17
Everyone on option tires now.

ShiftingGears
5th September 2008, 11:20
I wonder who thought splashing that radioactive green paint on most/all recently modified circuits was a good idea.

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:22
Primes or options that BMW is behaving like a boat.

ioan
5th September 2008, 11:28
So that was it for the first free practice, the order is: ferrari, ferrari, mcl, mcl, renault, RB, STR, STR

ioan
5th September 2008, 13:44
2nd free practice session to start in a few minutes.

ioan
5th September 2008, 13:51
Dry for now, but rain expected in 30 minutes.

CaptainRaiden
5th September 2008, 13:52
What is Massa smoking? I need some of that. If he manages to beat Kimi, the king of Spa (out of the current crop of F1 drivers), then Kimi is done and dusted for the championship. It seems Massa has the measure of Kimi on every track, even though it's still 1st free practice. Let's see.

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:05
Seems like it will rain in a short time.

samuratt
5th September 2008, 14:14
Seems like it will rain in a short time.

Poor Massa then... ;)

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:14
According to Trulli it's raining now.

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:15
Webber in the tire wall.

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:18
Poor Massa then... ;)

I'm not worried for him. If the car is set up accordingly than he'll be alright.

Knock-on
5th September 2008, 14:36
Not much going on

pino
5th September 2008, 14:47
According to Trulli it's raining now.

No rain at the moment ;)

pino
5th September 2008, 14:50
Problems for Kimi :s

pino
5th September 2008, 14:52
Kimi off, Alonso off, Fisi off :eek:

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:54
No rain at the moment ;)

No Trulli either! :p :

Kimi lost rear wing and maybe a bit oil?!

Fisi loses rear and front wing pieces.

Session red flagged.

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:55
Fisi lost it on Kimi's fluids! :D

ioan
5th September 2008, 14:58
WTF, they don't have an emergency exit from the track for 500m?!

ioan
5th September 2008, 15:04
It seems like it was rain water mixed with something, and not oil from Kimi's car.

Knock-on
5th September 2008, 15:08
It seems like it was rain water mixed with something, and not oil from Kimi's car.

Kimi lost it all by himself and went into the tyres backwards.

Looks like the impact dislodged standing water in the tyres that bled onto the racing line.

Although it was a trickle, it was enough to cause Fisi to slip his rear and spin into the barrier doing both the front and rear end.

His mechanics will be happy.

Didn't see any warning flags for fluid on the circuit though.

Knock-on
5th September 2008, 15:18
Massa seems to be struggleing in Int2

veeten
5th September 2008, 15:20
it's a difficult situation for the engineers at Spa.

That section is on a declining angle, so covering those tire coils in that barrier only causes rain runoff to go directly onto the track.

a drainage ditch, running directly under the section of the barrier where the tires are assembled, would alieviate that problem.

... but, that's just my opinion. :)

veeten
5th September 2008, 15:22
that's it, everyone in the pit now. :)

ioan
5th September 2008, 15:27
Didn't see any warning flags for fluid on the circuit though.

What for? The session has been red flagged.

ioan
5th September 2008, 15:29
Off topic.
Is it just me or the forums clock is wrong?
15:38 now.

ioan
5th September 2008, 15:31
Massa seems to be struggleing in Int2

Still good enough for having the fastest time of the first day.
Imagine what happens if gets that right too! :D

Knock-on
5th September 2008, 15:53
What for? The session has been red flagged.

After Kimi went off, you could clearly have seen the fluid.

Perhaps that would have been a good time to get the little stripey flag out instead of when someone crashed and that need to get the nasty big Red one instead.

Remember what flags are for? Blue ones for instance :laugh:

ioan
5th September 2008, 15:58
After Kimi went off, you could clearly have seen the fluid.

Perhaps that would have been a good time to get the little stripey flag out instead of when someone crashed and that need to get the nasty big Red one instead.

I believe they thought it was just rain water, and didn't think it will cause troubles, there were other cars that went by before Fisi managed to spun nto the barriers.
Anyway they had to clean the track, so it was going to be a red flag anyway.


Remember what flags are for? Blue ones for instance :laugh:

Get out of my way! :p :

Knock-on
5th September 2008, 16:07
It was just water. That's the point.

If they had of warned drivers, we would have avoided a Red flag

ioan
5th September 2008, 16:13
It was just water. That's the point.

If they had of warned drivers, we would have avoided a Red flag

What about the water? Would it have evaporated out of scare of the warning flags?!

Knock-on
5th September 2008, 17:21
What about the water? Would it have evaporated out of scare of the warning flags?!

OK, whatever. They shouldn't use Flags to warn drivers that a track is slipery and use them to mop the water up instead.

:laugh:

Anyway, I'm doing a rain dance for Sunday.

Should guarentee a Lewis win :D

ioan
5th September 2008, 17:23
Anyway, I'm doing a rain dance for Sunday.

Should guarentee a Lewis win :D

Or a parking place in the kitty litter! :rotflmao:

gloomyDAY
6th September 2008, 04:03
Or a parking place in the kitty litter! :rotflmao: lol

Sometimes I hate the fact that I laugh at your comebacks!

I'm off to the gym, come home and go to bed early, then catch qualifying at 5am! I'll see you guys on the chat forum. You better be there ioan!

Valve Bounce
6th September 2008, 06:25
I was at the MCG watching the Bulldogs getting massacred. It was so bad they had to call the RSPCA. :p :

ioan
6th September 2008, 13:54
Qualifying underway now!

ioan
6th September 2008, 14:14
So Bourdais first in Q1.

gloomyDAY
6th September 2008, 14:38
So Bourdais first in Q1.Bourdais' performance is a surprise. I'm glad he's competitive and finally being a challenge to Vettel. Maybe STR will make an about-face over the Frenchman and keep him for 2009.

Oh yeah, he sounded like a kid when he realized Q1 was his. :D

JOIN the chat ioan.

ioan
6th September 2008, 14:43
Thanks for the invitation!
I'm watching the qualifying on my laptop, couldn't keep a discussion in the same time. ;)

ioan
6th September 2008, 14:55
That was it!
Well done Hamilton!
Felipe and Kimi have work to do!

gloomyDAY
6th September 2008, 14:56
Hamilton....blitzed the entire field!

Tomorrow will be fun and especially if rain is involved.

ArrowsFA1
6th September 2008, 14:58
Great lap by Lewis :up: Heikki's in the mix with the Ferraris so we're set for an interesting race tomorrow. Good job by Heidfeld as well.

dwf1
6th September 2008, 15:03
I hope it rains tomorrow, that would be amazing!!!

VkmSpouge
6th September 2008, 15:15
Good qualifying, everything still tight between McLaren and Ferrari. Very good laps by both Lewis Hamilton and Felipe Massa. Both Toro Rossos going well.
I loved Martin Brundle's comment just after an interview with Jenson Button, "At least he's inside the top 20," :D

wedge
6th September 2008, 15:38
Is it just me or does it look like the Ferraris are running a bit more rear wing?

ioan
6th September 2008, 16:36
I loved Martin Brundle's comment just after an interview with Jenson Button, "At least he's inside the top 20," :D

:rotflmao:

truefan72
6th September 2008, 18:01
Is it just me or does it look like the Ferraris are running a bit more rear wing?

and that might work in their advantage if it rains

good qualy, I think its safe to say that Massa and LH will challenge for the WDC with kimi the dark horse. Kubica has fallen off the pace ( and bitching about the attention LOL)

I'm a bit disappointing with Heike( and Kimi for that matter), he went out last and couldn't do the job of securing a McLaren front row. He might be a bit heavier, but c'mon, the McLaren is still at least .300 better than the Ferrari's this weekend. (which imo is why I like what LH did. I think he's running heavier than the Ferrari's). Kimi needed to step up but didn't in qualy. But he's won this race 3 years in a row so don't count him out.

The star of this session was Bourdais, who's making STR management eat crow. Given a car with equal equipment, he's proven that he's more than up to the task. I will give Berger one thing though, This STR car seems to be getting better by leaps and bounds and I guess more can be expected from the drivers.
It's certainly miles ahead of the Red Bulls now and it will be interesting to see how this dynamic plays out.

Good job by Alonso to come in 6th.

Toyota's mysteriously are off pace. Nakajima's car seems to have been set up wrong. Honda is just terrible. Force India assuming their usual positions.

I think Heidfeld is gone after this year. He only seems to perform if his job's on the line or assumes some sort of pressure from his teammate. I wouldn't want a driver around who can't motivate himself to give 100% without being coaxed. If they do retain him, it should be at a race per race basis ( lol, highly unlikely) His performance is a bitof a mirage imo. Klien has some sort of a grin on him as if he knows something about his future (until Alonso comes knocking)

can't wait for tomorrow

ioan
6th September 2008, 18:16
I think Heidfeld is gone after this year. He only seems to perform if his job's on the line or assumes some sort of pressure from his teammate. I wouldn't want a driver around who can't motivate himself to give 100% without being coaxed. If they do retain him, it should be at a race per race basis ( lol, highly unlikely) His performance is a bitof a mirage imo.

:laugh:

So the guy ups his game, beats his overrated team mate and all of a sudden he should go!
Not sure I get it, unless you are afraid that BMW will keep Heidfeld and thus Alonso will have to stay with Renault or go to Honda! ;)

truefan72
6th September 2008, 18:35
:laugh:

So the guy ups his game, beats his overrated team mate and all of a sudden he should go!
Not sure I get it, unless you are afraid that BMW will keep Heidfeld and thus Alonso will have to stay with Renault or go to Honda! ;)

Well that's the problem isn't it ion,. How many times has Heidfeld had to "up his game" due to the fear of losing his seat. or the fear of beng relegated to clear no.2 status in the team. Zero race wins, sporadic top performances and clearly a reactive rather than proactive attitude towards performing toh is peak.

I like him, and think he is a serviceable driver, i just don't think he's got that killer instinct. He really does't bring much more to the BMW team and is on the wrong side of the age argument. Klien is young and hungry. Alonso is a prove winner who could make BMW a consistent podium sight and occasional winner. Both options are more favorable than continuing with Heidfeld.

btw, how is Kubica overrated. I seem to recall him having his teammate's number all year long, winning a GP and being the only guy out there consistently mixing it up with the Mac's and Ferrari's...and oh, what's his current position in the WDC. to call him overrated,now that is laughable.

ioan
6th September 2008, 19:05
I like Kubica as a driver and as a person, but let me tell you why Kubica is overrated.
Because he got his GP win gifted to him by the team, at Heidfelds expenses.
Because I never saw him pull the overtaking moves that I saw from Heidfeld, still you say that Nick doesn't have the killer instinct, go figure!
And because like Heidfeld as soon as the car was nowhere to his liking his performance is poor!
And looking at this morning wet free practice I say that if tomorrow we get rain than Heidfeld will have a honest shot at winning his first race, based on legitimate performance, not team orders.

This is what I think.


Well that's the problem isn't it ion,.

Who's ion? :confused:

F1boat
6th September 2008, 19:39
I am stunned by the advantage with McLaren had. They have this race in the bag.

markabilly
6th September 2008, 19:42
I am stunned by the advantage with McLaren had. They have this race in the bag.


Aint over until it is over....

jens
6th September 2008, 21:41
Well, not much surprising in this qualifying.

Cooler conditions really suit McLaren and hence they looked really quick. Actually Heikki should have secured a front row, but probably made a mistake.

That longer lap probably helped Kimi and Nick a bit, so that they had more time to get heat into the tyres. Very good Q by Heidfeld and Räikkönen seemed ahead of Massa for some time too, but the Brazilian's last lap was great (like he said at the press conf) and Kimi couldn't respond to it.

Great qualy by Webber, although I suspect that among the midfielders he's the lightest. He was really struggled for most of the Q, managing to get into Top10 narrowly, but ended up 7th in Q3. Williams is quick only on street circuits, so nothing from them this time.

Temperature-wise Toyota's car has in some way similar characteristics as Ferrari, although in their case the influence is bigger. For some reason Toyota has had the same syndrome already from the beginning of their F1 project - their best performances tend to take place in hot conditions. I wonder whether they'll ever manage to overcome this tendency...

But on the other hand P11 on the grid isn't bad for Jarno. I'd say it's better than let's say P10. :D With safety car Toyota is in a good position and even without it they can play with strategy. At Valencia Glock rose from P13 to P7 in the race.

ioan
6th September 2008, 22:06
Temperature-wise Toyota's car has in some way similar characteristics as Ferrari, although in their case the influence is bigger. For some reason Toyota has had the same syndrome already from the beginning of their F1 project - their best performances tend to take place in hot conditions.

That's because both Ferrari and Toyota are easy on the tires, that's also why we witnessed their drivers doing more than half a race on the softer tires on occasions. This means that when the track is hotter their tires can get to a temperature very close to their optimal temperature.

McLaren are the opposite, their car is very heavy on the tires and easily over cooks them in combination with hotter track temperatures, while a cold track helps keep the tire temperatures down, closer to the optimum.

However for Ferrari and Toyota this is more of a disadvantege during the qualifying sessions when they have less time to heat the tires up.

ShiftingGears
7th September 2008, 03:15
I like Kubica as a driver and as a person, but let me tell you why Kubica is overrated.
Because he got his GP win gifted to him by the team, at Heidfelds expenses.
Because I never saw him pull the overtaking moves that I saw from Heidfeld, still you say that Nick doesn't have the killer instinct, go figure!
And because like Heidfeld as soon as the car was nowhere to his liking his performance is poor!
And looking at this morning wet free practice I say that if tomorrow we get rain than Heidfeld will have a honest shot at winning his first race, based on legitimate performance, not team orders.

This is what I think.


He was faster than Heidfeld in Canada, and thats why he won. I don't think Kubica is overrated, because leading the championship several races in, with the third best car, is no small feat.

mstillhere
7th September 2008, 04:27
Cooler conditions really suit McLaren and hence they looked really quick

Actually if you guys think about it, this year we have had quite a few races in the wet and that myght explain Ferrari's "poor" oerformances. In hot weather (Valencia for example) they don't seem to have problems. On the contrary. So, that should explain LH's fast performance not Kovi's unless he is loaded, which I think he is. Of course why him and not Lewis, but that's an other story.

ShiftingGears
7th September 2008, 05:46
Actually if you guys think about it, this year we have had quite a few races in the wet and that myght explain Ferrari's "poor" oerformances.

That is a good point. For that reason I think Ferrari will struggle in Singapore, compared to McLaren.

Valve Bounce
7th September 2008, 11:36
And looking at this morning wet free practice I say that if tomorrow we get rain than Heidfeld will have a honest shot at winning his first race, based on legitimate performance, not team orders.

This is what I think.


So has bunsen




.............if most of the cars at teh front get knocked out, and if bunsen manages to fudge it to the front of the queue, and if it is too dangerous for the safety car to come back in.

But Hell!!! it is some sorta chance!!

AJP
7th September 2008, 13:03
Hi peoples....

anyone have a link to a live feed on the net please???

ArrowsFA1
7th September 2008, 13:45
Looks like the weather could provide us with a bit of unpredictability this afternoon :) Could there be a chance for a team other than Ferrari or McLaren to take the victory...?

gloomyDAY
7th September 2008, 13:51
Hi peoples....

anyone have a link to a live feed on the net please???

http://www.soccer-live.pl/ITVF1/f1player.php

Everyone join the chat room! :D

ArrowsFA1
7th September 2008, 15:24
Fantasticc stuff!!! It was so even between Kimi & Lewis in the dry and it took a great move by Lewis to get the win. Even then he almost lost it a couple of times, and I think Kimi's desperation showed. He really needed a win, and didn't want to give up his lead but lost it as a result.

In terms of the championship that's a massive win for Hamilton.

ioan
7th September 2008, 15:25
So, Heidfeld showed his experience!

Ferrari and Massa took the wrong tactical decision, in hindsight!

m.lowe
7th September 2008, 15:42
Excellent win for Lewis well done
I was happy for him to finish 2nd to bag points but when he started getting closer fists where clenched and I had to shout quietly as my 3 year old is asleep

one of the best finishes upto now

Come and do some rallying now to see how you get on

VkmSpouge
7th September 2008, 16:15
Good fun that last few laps. I think all the drivers did exceedingly well to make it around the track. Felt sorry for Raikkonen to lose the race win, the championship and crash out. Nick Heidfeld got the strategy spot on and claimed a good third place.

jens
7th September 2008, 16:41
Absolutely insane race! :D

Hamilton vs Räikkönen in the end - incredible! It's difficult to remember such finale for a Grand Prix like this!
IMO Massa showed a lot of maturity in the end not to take unnecessary risks and score valuable WDC-points. With all those spins ahead of him he wasn't far from a win either. Massa is now in perfect position to become Ferrari's No.1 driver for the rest of the season.
Heidfeld has often managed to capitalize on tricky conditions and he did it again.
Kovalainen is not a soft racer like some tend to say - he made quite a lot of overtaking manouvers. :D Although on the flip side was clumsy at times too...
Webber was doing well until Kovalainen ran into him.
Great race by STR - they have a good chance of finishing 6th in the WCC this year. Probably a bit difficult to rise higher than that (19 pts behind Renault).
Toyota must be satisfied with that one point Glock brought them - the maximum they could get in a difficult weekend.
Trulli had an awesome start, but after Bourdais had knocked quite several pieces off his car, the race was basically over for him...