LV and NH are no-go's

[-Helix-]

http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/racing/indycar/news/story?id=3510273

Article also confirms Infineon, Texas, and Kentucky for next year.

SMI is ridiculous. They have no problem with running the oval but the road course is off limits? :rolleyes:

Gossage needs to get his head out of his ass. There are enough boring ovals and there's nothing special about Las Vegas' oval.

[icehammer97]

I find it interesting that the IRL wanted to end the season on a road course espically since the rumors say they are going to start at one too.

[Rogelio]

Now that TG holds the reins to AOWR there will be no one else to blame but himself. As the ICS comes to a 'uneventful' end, the series seems to be floundering along even without the competition that was CART/CC.

There is an untapped market out there of former CART/CC fans. They happen to live in cities that once supported and were the foundation of AOWR. Now, that the split is over, those fans and cities are largely ignored. What a way to mend bridges TG.

[-Helix-]

Now that TG holds the reins to AOWR there will be no one else to blame but himself. As the ICS comes to a 'uneventful' end, the series seems to be floundering along even without the competition that was CART/CC.

There is an untapped market out there of former CART/CC fans. They happen to live in cities that once supported and were the foundation of AOWR. Now, that the split is over, those fans and cities are largely ignored. What a way to mend bridges TG.


What's with the doom and gloom? This is pretty good news in my opinion.

Are you saying you actually WANTED to run the oval?

I fail to see how adding another crappy identical oval is a good thing. Especially one that has been NASCAR-ified.

[icehammer97]

I think either one would have been a bad idea. The oval is just like others and the road course is on 1.3 miles long (unless there was a typo on autoracing1.com). Having a road course that short is a joke too.

[-Helix-]

I think either one would have been a bad idea. The oval is just like others and the road course is on 1.3 miles long (unless there was a typo on autoracing1.com). Having a road course that short is a joke too.

Yeah, I re-read that and realized even the road course would've been lame. SMI was still stupid to reject the idea, though I'm glad they did.

[BenRoethig]

What's with the doom and gloom? This is pretty good news in my opinion.

Are you saying you actually WANTED to run the oval?

I fail to see how adding another crappy identical oval is a good thing. Especially one that has been NASCAR-ified.

And adding another street course would be any better? Trust me, with a Vegas street course 7 of the last 9 events would be road/ street courses and they would be pretty boring by the time of the finale.

[icehammer97]

And adding another street course would be any better? Trust me, with a Vegas street course 7 of the last 9 events would be road/ street courses and they would be pretty boring by the time of the finale.

Actually if this schedule is a correct guess
Apr 05 St. Petersburg 1.78 Mile Street
Apr 12 Long Beach 1.97 Mile Street
Apr 19 <--Sonoma could move here or be dropped--|
Apr 26 Kansas City 1.5 M Oval..................|
May 24 Indianapolis, IN 2.5 mile Oval.......... |
May 31 West Allis, WI 1.032 Mile Oval......... |
Jun 6 Ft Worth, TX (Sat. Nite)................ |
Jun 14 Newton, IA 0.875 Mile Oval.............. |
Jun 27 Richmond, VA (Sat. Night)............... |
Jul 5 Watkins Glen 3.37 Mile RC............... |
TBD Lexington, OH 2.258 Mile RC............. |
TBD Toronto, CN 1.721 Mile Street........... |
TBD Edmonton CN 1.96 Mi Airport............. |
TBD Sparta, KY (Sat Nite) 1.5 Mile Oval......|
TBD Sonoma, CA RC --------------------------
Sep 06 Detroit, MI 2.096 Mi. RC
Sep 13 Joliet, Ill. 1.5 Mile Oval
Sep 27 Motegi, Japan Sat 1.549 Oval
Oct 04 Queensland, Au 2.795 Mi Street
Oct 11 Homestead-Miami 1.5 Mile oval

Only 2 or the last 5 will be been Road courses so it would have been 3 of 6. The Vegas guys were smart not letting Indycar making them look bad by having a 1.3 mile road course repersent them. If they wanted the Vegas market and wanted a road course the street course that Champ Car ran they last year there would have been the best choice.

[BenRoethig]

That one makes a lot more sense.

[gofastandwynn]

From tomorrow's USA Today:


Sunshine State becomes a hub for IRL in 2009

By Nate Ryan, USA TODAY
Florida will become a focal point next year for the IndyCar Series, which also will continue its Canadian expansion.
The Honda Grand Prix of St. Petersburg will open the 2009 season April 5, taking the leadoff spot held by Homestead-Miami Speedway since 2002. Homestead will shift to the finale Oct. 11, extending the season a month longer than the past two seasons.

The IRL will make its first visits next year to the streets of Long Beach, Calif., (April 19) and Toronto (July 12), which will be followed by Edmonton (July 26) for back-to-back stops on temporary circuits north of the border.

Edmonton made its IndyCar debut to a strong crowd last weekend, and Terry Angstadt, president of the IRL's commercial division, said the reception was similar to St. Petersburg, which has become one of the circuit's biggest stops since its 2005 debut.

"St. Pete will be a great opener," Angstadt said. "It's a big-event feel, festive, well-attended and shows well on TV."

Angstadt said the series wanted a warm-weather oval such as Homestead as its finale. The 1.5-mile superspeedway also plays host to the November season finales of NASCAR's three national series.

"That gives Homestead an opportunity to market themselves as a venue of champions," Angstadt said.

The series won't return to Nashville Superspeedway, and the Surfers Paradise, Australia, event also is missing from next year's schedule, which was released today. Angstadt said there's a possibility Australia, which will hold a non-points IndyCar race on Oct. 26, could be added in '09.

"We're optimistic," he said. "We've given them a couple of time slots. It may take a little while."

Angstadt said the IRL also had fruitful discussions with New Hampshire Motor Speedway, Las Vegas Motor Speedway and temporary circuits in Cleveland and Houston that were Champ Car venues.

Angstadt said "there's not a big window" at New Hampshire because of NASCAR Sprint Cup races in late June and mid-September, and IndyCar isn't ready for Las Vegas' 142,000-seat grandstands.

"For us to put 50-60,000 fans in a place like that, it's almost not good for either side," Angstadt said. "We want to keep an open dialogue. We've also had very positive conversations with Cleveland and Houston, which are both very viable locations. We're not assuming these venues will stay interested forever. We know there's a great window of opportunity, and there's a lot of urgency."

Angstadt said IndyCar is aiming for a 20-race schedule, possibly by 2011.

Other highlights of next year:

•Chicagoland Speedway is moving to a Saturday night race Aug. 29, exchanging dates with the Detroit Belle Isle Grand Prix (Sept. 6).

•Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course is moving to Aug. 9 to interrupt a stretch of six consecutive races this year. The series won't race more than four in a row in '09.

•The Indy Japan 300 at Twin Ring Motegi shifts to Sept. 19 after six consecutive seasons in April.

•The addition of Toronto brings a nearly even balance of ovals (10) and street- or road-course races (eight) for a series that was contested exclusively on ovals from 1996 to 2004.

"It's a true test of skill," Angstadt said. "We like aiming toward a 50-50 balance."

•Angstadt said the title sponsorship of the IndyCar Series was being strongly considered by two companies for '09. The circuit is hoping to sign a deal in 30 to 45 days.


2009 IRL INDYCAR SCHEDULE

Date Track
April 5 Streets of St. Petersburg, Fla.
April 19 Streets of Long Beach
April 26 Kansas Speedway
May 24 Indianapolis Motor Speedway
May 31 The Milwaukee Mile
June 6 Texas Motor Speedway*
June 21 Iowa Speedway
June 27 Richmond International Raceway*
July 5 Watkins Glen International
July 12 Streets of Toronto
July 26 Edmonton City Centre Airport
Aug. 1 Kentucky Speedway*
Aug. 9 Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course
Aug. 23 Infineon Raceway
Aug. 29 Chicagoland Speedway*
Sept. 6 The Raceway at Belle Isle Park
Sept. 19 Twin Ring Motegi, Japan
Oct. 11 Homestead-Miami Speedway

[Dr. Krogshöj]

I don't see Surfers Paradise but I see an empty slot for it on September 26. This date would make sense in terms of logistics and scheduling.

As for Vegas, 1.5 mile ovals are not my favourite type of racetracks but this club course request seems plain stupid to me.

[Chris R]

My only real complaint is why are they still going to Homestead??? It would be nice to see Cleveland also and one of these days they need something in the northeast/mid-atlantic....

[Lousada]

I simply cannot understand this. They say they do not want to have 50.000 people in a 150000 motordrome, yet they are perfectly happy to end the season with 25.000 people in a 75.000 oval. This is excluding the fact that the IRL closer will be very close to the Nascar closer at the same track. Guess what trackmanagement considers more important?
I looked up the LVMS on google earth. I can't get my mind to it why the IRL would want to race on that parking lot track. It does not have grandstands or a pits and I do not see proper runoffs. It does not look suitable for Indycars, nor even Indy Lights.
Okay I get Las Vegas and New Hampshire were gigantic failures in the past. But seeing that SMI requested the tracks to the IRL, I'd guess that SMI believed it would be profitable and enough people would show up.

[domaza]

Why do they not want to go back to Surfers?

[seppefan]

Surfers is a must and if it was to be dropped then that would be a criminal act

[Osiris333]

Look, I'm as big a Cartisan as they come, but Surfers either needs to be in the Spring or be dropped. Unless the Aussies are going to sponsor a 2-car team in the series, why should Indycar race there? IC needs to shore up the NAFTA market first. It's not a big money international series like it was before the split anymore.

I also don't like this schedule too much, but it really seems to be transitional. They do need to tap into the traditional CC fans in cities like Cleveland for sure.

I'm dissapointed that they aren't running the Vegas oval. IC needs a second marquee event, and finishing the season there with a 500 miler would be cool. The event can be built up as the series is built up.

I agree that the 1.5 mile races are horrible. The solution is simple: make the wings smaller and\or add the Hanford device. It may be a gimmick, but it will make the racing safer and be a better show. In fact, they need to make the wings smaller for all the tracks, as long as they're sticking with the CW chasis for 2 more years.

And how about Kannan and Tracy @ Walker\Vision next year?

[dataman1]

Why do they not want to go back to Surfers?

Hey, guys down under help me if I mis-state this message.

The issue with Surfers IMO has to do with sanction fee, moving the date and getting the V8's to move their date.

I believe the government still supports the race/event but moving the date interupts their ability to attract a large crowd due to less than perfect weather. The Event is the reason many people come not the cars on the track. Change the weather and you will effect the number of hotels rented and beer drank.

I would also bet that ICS is asking for a larger sanctioning fee than CCWS has in the past 2 years and the promoter is choking a little on the decimal points.

There is also an issue with the other series that run. They have to change their schedules also. Keep in mind that the V8's are just as big as Nascar to the Austrailians. The V8's put on some very good events without Indy cars and frankly have been a bigger part of the Indy weekend over past 5 years. They may want more cash to move their date.

Just one persons opinion.

[garyshell]

What's with the doom and gloom? This is pretty good news in my opinion.

Are you saying you actually WANTED to run the oval?

I fail to see how adding another crappy identical oval is a good thing. Especially one that has been NASCAR-ified.


And adding another street course would be any better? Trust me, with a Vegas street course 7 of the last 9 events would be road/ street courses and they would be pretty boring by the time of the finale.


Where did helix say anything about a street course???

Gary

[Rogelio]

Why do they not want to go back to Surfers?

Why would the ICS not want Surfers? Surfers, along with Long Beach, are proven winners with a long tradition. Not to mention, there are several drivers in the series from the lands down under. This years race, unlike others will be immensely popular.

The ICS should do everything possible to keep the race and a similar date on its scheudle.

[dataman1]

Hey, guys down under help me if I mis-state this message.

The issue with Surfers IMO has to do with sanction fee, moving the date and getting the V8's to move their date.

I believe the government still supports the race/event but moving the date interupts their ability to attract a large crowd due to less than perfect weather. The Event is the reason many people come not the cars on the track. Change the weather and you will effect the number of hotels rented and beer drank.

I would also bet that ICS is asking for a larger sanctioning fee than CCWS has in the past 2 years and the promoter is choking a little on the decimal points.

There is also an issue with the other series that run. They have to change their schedules also. Keep in mind that the V8's are just as big as Nascar to the Austrailians. The V8's put on some very good events without Indy cars and frankly have been a bigger part of the Indy weekend over past 5 years. They may want more cash to move their date.

Just one persons opinion.

Oops! It would be Japan moving its date not Australia. Excuse me please.

[Chaparral66]

I just heard that NHMS in fact is a go for next year, the schedule should be coming out soon...

[dataman1]

I just heard that NHMS in fact is a go for next year, the schedule should be coming out soon...

The schedule is out. Go back to post #10.

[Chaparral66]

Yikes, you're right. Maybe it'll come to NHMS next year. One can hope.

[dataman1]

Message below from NHMS. They are not happy at all.

New Hampshire Motor Speedway executive vice president and general manager Jerry Gappens released a statement Tuesday evening regarding the Indy Racing League's decision to leave New Hampshire Motor Speedway off its 2009 schedule.

"I'm extremely disappointed for our fans, who have given us some real positive feedback about the possible return of IndyCar racing to New Hampshire Motor Speedway," Gappens said in the statement. "In fact, in a recent poll on nhms.com, nearly 80-percent of our fans said they wanted to see this exciting form of motorsports return. That's a strong endorsement, and I don't understand the decision not to include our facility on next year's schedule.

"I think it's a slap in the face to our chairman Bruton Smith and to our company who have been very supportive of the Indy Racing League since its inception, and to [former NHMS owner] Bob Bahre, who was first to agree to go with them when they split off [from CART in 1995].

"I sat in a meeting and watched Bruton ask them for a race here, which they seemed extremely interested in doing, pending scheduling conflicts with Japan. In addition, in that same meeting, they asked him to host the series finale in Las Vegas, which he agreed to and even offered the speedway and financial support to do it this year. Having attended that meeting in early June, it's hard to believe that neither is on the new schedule.

"The feedback that has been conveyed to me is that they don't want to add an additional race to the schedule in respect to the cost to the teams. However, I would think that an additional purse and the strength of adding the seventh largest media market in the country would offset those costs and concerns. I think this market and facility have a lot to offer the team and series sponsors.

"I thought that [Texas Motor Speedway general manager] Eddie Gossage, who on behalf of Speedway Motorsports, made an excellent proposal to the league, which included Las Vegas and New Hampshire. I don't want to burn any bridges, but I am upset to be excluded. I am a big fan of open-wheel racing, strongly admire what the Hulman-George family has done for this sport and promise that we would have worked hard to promote a race in this market. They know they would get an excellent effort from our team here at New Hampshire Motor Speedway. History has proven that this venue provided exciting races. Now, we'll see what happens down the road."

AutoRacing1.com's position all along was that the IRL should never race at a race track where the number of grandstands seats were built to accommodate NASCAR races when the IRL can only fill 25% or less. The empty seats would make (and have in the past made) the IndyCar series look like complete losers. What sponsor wants to get involved with a series that looks like a loser? Open wheel racing has failed in these markets in the past and they will fail in the future unless huge sums of money are spent in the market to educate and entice potential new fans. Apparently the IRL went through a similar thought process and came to the same conclusion.