Reality will set in quickly...

[ChicagocrewIRL]

It was a great St. Pete Grand Prix weekend and a new star of AOWR was born and baptized on the streets in Florida. The former CCWS teams did phenomenal and I think should be very pleased how they performed against the IRL regulars, especially the road course guys like Castroneves, Kanaan and Dixon.

That being said, I think cold hard reality will set in quickly after Long Beach. The first race after the mini split of April 28/29 will be the high banked Kansas D-oval where car setup is crucial. Then nothing but ovals ovals ovals until July 6. It will be very interesting to see how the ex-CCWS teams and drivers handle the challenge. I think Graham has oval racing in his blood and will do fine.

Do the ex-CCWS teams have time to get into a wind tunnel during that time or is that type of testing only possible in the off season ???

[dataman1]

There is a wind tunnel in Indy next door to Walker Racing. Cash will be a factor.

I agree with your assessment. There are (were) some sharp engineers that mastered oval setups with Lolas at Milwaukee and Fontana. If they are still around I expect them to find the magic formula quickly. Most of those guys have had to do that for several chassis in the past so they can master this one as well. It will just take time. The key is whether they can keep the cars off the walls while they search for that setup.

[Osiris333]

I think that St. Pete is the reality. The IRL cars are easy to drive, easy to set up, and on road circuits where driving skill takes precedence over set-up, the former Champ Car teams do just fine. The ovals will be a challenge, but with two weeks of practice at Indy, I expect the CC teams to be very competitive there.

St. Pete shows just how soft Penske, Ganassi, Andretti, et. al have gotten by driving around in circles for the last five years. One of the reasons that most of us ignored the IRL was because we believed that road racing separated the men from the boys. I think this was just proven out.

Let's hope that the new formula makes the cars far more of a challenge to drive, so that the Indycar can become the world class series it was before the split.

[Redracer]

The nine transition teams should really share all their resources and data with each other. If the teams were assigned a section of the chassis to develop that would help until the new car is in place.

[xtlm]

"One of the reasons that most of us ignored the IRL was because we believed that road racing separated the men from the boys. I think this was just proven out."

ugh

i guess i will never understand

[weeflyonthewall]

"One of the reasons that most of us ignored the IRL was because we believed that road racing separated the men from the boys. I think this was just proven out."

ugh

i guess i will never understand

How come the IRL fans weren't as critical of Penske, AGR, Rahal, Ganassi, when they were "transition teams" back in 2002? It didn't take them very long to get the IRL cars dialed in. It will only get better from here. I'm looking forward to Indy and Milwaukee. Those two tracks require a lot more driving skill than the high banked ovals like Kansas.

[NickFalzone]

The good news is that they won't be running Motegi, which would be a similar deal as Homestead. The month of May will give the teams a lot of insight into chassis adjustments for oval racing as well as seat time for the drivers. The top teams like NHL will definitely be competitive on ovals by the summer, you can count on it. That said, besides Indy, I expect Watkins, Sonoma, Belle Isle, and Mid Ohio to be the most competitive races this year. With how SP went, I'd bet that the AGRs and Penskes will up their game for the road races, this weekend's race surprised them.

[Osiris333]

I'm sure they'll try to up their games, but if their drivers have really gone soft because of all the oval racing, will it matter on road\street circuits?

I'm just trying to imagine what Paul Tracy would do on a street circuit in one of these cars. Hope I get the chance to find out.

[nigelred5]

Don't forget to add in Edmonton where they also have the slight advantage of knowing the track conficuration and the racing surface.

[keysersoze]

One of the reasons that most of us ignored the IRL was because we believed that road racing separated the men from the boys. I think this was just proven out.

O-sir-is, you can't be serious. Couldn't help the pun. :D

Sir-is-ly, though, you couldn't be more wrong. St.Pete practice and qualifying revealed what we ALL already knew--that the CCWS drivers would be strong on the twisty stuff, and would adapt well to the Dallara in RR trim.

The race itself was very inconclusive, other than exposing the drivers we already knew would be weak--the Foyts, the Carpenters, the Roths, and the Patricks of the world. I was surprised at Jay Howard's pace. Nearly everyone else was competitive (not so much Rice), and with the changing conditions, the final results were pretty much a lottery. I mean, I don't expect Justin Wilson to be that far down the final results unless he crashes. Will Power also looked liked he struggled, or was perhaps caught out by changing conditions or an unlucky pit strategy. No one thinks Junquiera will be this ineffective race in and race out.

[ChicagocrewIRL]

I think A J IV did quite respectable at St Pete just missing out on the top 10 and Danica despite 3 spins raced her way back to a top 10 finish. I think if she wasn't Danica we all would be applauding her for an incredible drive. If Paul Tracy spun 3 times and ended up in the top 10 what would our reactions be ? C'mon be honest !!

But A J IV was most impressive managing to finish ahead of Wheldon, Hunter Reay, Dixon, and a whole host of more experienced "road racers"

[xtlm]

"I'm sure they'll try to up their games, but if their drivers have really gone soft because of all the oval racing, will it matter on road\street circuits?"

i'm sure whenever PT comes, he will be soft on the ovals

its all the matter of perspective.

[ChicagocrewIRL]

Well to me. all this talk of oval racing being easy is just ridiculous. I think running at those speeds in packs with the conditions changing all the time depending whether you're in traffic or running alone or nose to tail has got to be one of the most grueling mental challenges a driver can face, lap after lap on the edge pushing the envelope so to speak, without tearing it. I'm sure that in the back of each driver's minds are the horrible images of Kenny Brack and Ryan Briscoe's accidents and the horrible tragic deaths of Tony Renna and Greg Moore.

To me, it's the bravest most daring thing a race car driver can do, is to run 220-230 mph lap after lap in traffic while trying to improve your position.

Sure drag racers run faster but for short bursts and not over a course of over 2 hours.

Sure NASCAR drivers run ovals at high speed but they do it in armored vehicles where there are large margins of error (rubbin' is racin' type stuff).

Sure Formula 1 and the old CCWS run road courses and sure they probably require more driver skill, but courage ? I would dare say, the bravest drivers in the world are high speed open wheel oval drivers.

[IWUTitan90]

O-sir-is, you can't be serious. Couldn't help the pun. :D

Sir-is-ly, though, you couldn't be more wrong. St.Pete practice and qualifying revealed what we ALL already knew--that the CCWS drivers would be strong on the twisty stuff, and would adapt well to the Dallara in RR trim.

The race itself was very inconclusive, other than exposing the drivers we already knew would be weak--the Foyts, the Carpenters, the Roths, and the Patricks of the world. I was surprised at Jay Howard's pace. Nearly everyone else was competitive (not so much Rice), and with the changing conditions, the final results were pretty much a lottery. I mean, I don't expect Justin Wilson to be that far down the final results unless he crashes. Will Power also looked liked he struggled, or was perhaps caught out by changing conditions or an unlucky pit strategy. No one thinks Junquiera will be this ineffective race in and race out.


Just for perspective sake, the road/street "twisty" stuff was going to show who the "real" racers were, or so I've read. But yet Danica races her way UP from 19th to 10th and she is "weak". Power on the other hand, races his way from 2nd BACK to 8th, yet it was "changing conditions" or "unlucky pit strategy". So now, passing people is bad, and having two things that have ZERO to do with being a "racer" affect your finish, is good?

alrighty then.

[FormerFF]

I agree with nickfalzone. I think that having all that practice time in May will get the ex-ChampCar teams in the hunt on the remaining ovals. I'd still expect the Ganassi and Penske drivers, plus Tony Kanaan, to win most if not all the ovals, but I think the some of the better ex-ChampCar teams and some of the other returning teams will be up there.

Speaking of Danica, it would be a boost to the series' popularity if she could pick off a win. I think her best chance is in the next two races. She always does well at Motegi, and with a smaller field, I think that's her best chance this year. After that, maybe she'll have a chance at Kansas, and of course Indy always requires some good fortune to win.

She hasn't shown the ability to race with the fastest cars, so I suspect her best chance will be through some sort of alternate strategy. The problem with trying to win that way is that it doesn't work very often, and if there are a lot of competive but not quite top rank cars, she may have a fair bit of company on any alternate strategy.

[T-D]

Well to me. all this talk of oval racing being easy is just ridiculous. I think running at those speeds in packs with the conditions changing all the time depending whether you're in traffic or running alone or nose to tail has got to be one of the most grueling mental challenges a driver can face, lap after lap on the edge pushing the envelope so to speak, without tearing it. I'm sure that in the back of each driver's minds are the horrible images of Kenny Brack and Ryan Briscoe's accidents and the horrible tragic deaths of Tony Renna and Greg Moore.

To me, it's the bravest most daring thing a race car driver can do, is to run 220-230 mph lap after lap in traffic while trying to improve your position.

Sure drag racers run faster but for short bursts and not over a course of over 2 hours.

Sure NASCAR drivers run ovals at high speed but they do it in armored vehicles where there are large margins of error (rubbin' is racin' type stuff).

Sure Formula 1 and the old CCWS run road courses and sure they probably require more driver skill, but courage ? I would dare say, the bravest drivers in the world are high speed open wheel oval drivers.if courage is your hot button, then there are lots of sports that deliver far more than auto racing. i'm thinking of mixed martial arts, for one.

anywho, the racing at homestead was boring, but the racing at st. pete was terrific. speed differential between the two events was substantial. i'd bet it takes substantial courage to push a 650 hp open cockpit car to its maximum limits on a wet race track.

[nanders]

if courage is your hot button, then there are lots of sports that deliver far more than auto racing. i'm thinking of mixed martial arts, for one.

anywho, the racing at homestead was boring, but the racing at st. pete was terrific. speed differential between the two events was substantial. i'd bet it takes substantial courage to push a 650 hp open cockpit car to its maximum limits on a wet race track.

I was thinking just the other way. I thought Homestead showed some great racing but beside the fact Rahal won in St Pete, I thought the racing was a little boring. And I'm a road race fan.

[usgrandprix]

Lots of drivers run can run flat, in one groove, with the wings full, tp low, camber dragging, and fuel back for help out of the turn. They usually don't happen to be the ones you talk to at the end of the race.

The one you interview at the end of an oval race tends to be the one who can run a trimmed out car flat on cold tires, on worn tires, in multiple grooves, in changing conditions, full rich, light and heavy fuel, has fast pit ins (basically road course turns), can pass, can maintain momentum in traffic, can recover from the guaranteed bobble you will have, etc. And the one who knows just where his limit is and can communicate it to his team.

But the real point here is that not all ovals are the same. Texas, banking does too much work for the driver. Richmond, not so much. Motegi, asymmetric and brutal in race conditions.

Relatively it's more a question of tracks than cars at this point. The current Indycar requires more skill on ovals than any in the IRL series history if you go by reduced DF and lack of TC now. It's not your "grandma's" Indycar and to perpetuate the idea that it is does no favors to new fans and reveals ignorance or a willingness to compromise your true understanding of racing. If they are making steps toward lifting in and accelerating out of turns at Indy, and that's what you claim you want, then maybe you should be more positive when they are making strides toward that.

Historically there were plenty of driver's ovals, including Homestead at one point.

Lead lap is a big tell. There were 4 cars on the lead lap at the end of the race at Homestead (at a track I admit I don't really care for). It was a blistering pace with few yellows (the ultimate driver's aid). The point being that the oval racing at even cookie cutters is considerably more driver-dependent than it was just a few years ago.

Look how spread out they were even at the front. I think it's better racing and it's obvious. I think it's a shame to paint all oval racing with an absolute brush and not take notice at an evolution here or consider how varied ovals can be. I'd like to see more of a distinction from "other" forms of oval racing continue and be rewarded by the so-called knowledgeable fans so eventually there is no room for less than the best drivers in the world. We're not there yet, but to deny that there have been considerable steps toward it just turns it into a proxy argument about something else, really.

I liked St. Petes, but Graham won on fuel in a shortened race. Yes, he was racey and probably passed the most people and I look forward to seeing him do it again. But if the race had gone the distance, he would have had to have stopped when a bunch would not have had to. And AJ IV was on the lead lap. I really enjoyed it, too.

When people listen to what you want, more road courses and a harder car to drive, and you don't acknowledge it, people stop listening to you. How about helping give some fans a little power back in this equation rather than hurling broad falsehoods based on an agenda.

I happen to think that ovals are as big a loser in the whole split as anything. The rise of the Texases and Chicagos came at the cost of some ovals I really liked. Of course, NASCAR has a lot to do with that too.

[keysersoze]

^^^^

heck of a post, usgrandprix.

[FerrrariF1]

The Champcar teams are dead in the water on ovals until they get new chassis plus spare parts. Most teams have barely enough parts to do basic manitainance on a race weekend. The chassis they were all given were castoffs and show cars of the IRL teams. Not one team received a new chassis. A large number of them have multiple repairs on the tub and flex like crazy. NHL rejected their first chassis as totally being unfit. Bruno has had to drop out of both races as his chassis has been undriveable due to to flexing.
They contacted Dallara and the chassis made four trips for tub repairs. The chassis weren't even rollers they were are tubs in a crate with the parts to make a complete car. No doubt the teams stripped off the good parts and put well used parts in the crate.

Until Champcar teams get sufficent spares as well as chassis that on par with the IRL teams they won't be close on the ovals. You can bet that NHL and KV will do everything in their power and pocket to get at least two new chassis each.

[ChicagocrewIRL]

And until they get back up cars, the CCWS teams will be like basketball players playing with four fouls. They won't be able go flat out for fear of crashing and not having a back up. I think once they get their spare cars then they will run the ovals with a little more ba**s.

[mlj]

And until they get back up cars, the CCWS teams will be like basketball players playing with four fouls. They won't be able go flat out for fear of crashing and not having a back up. I think once they get their spare cars then they will run the ovals with a little more ba**s.

Welcome Coach Crean. Indiana Basketball is BACK !!! (once we get a few recruits)

We sure didn't want to give you Crean, hope you like him as much as we did

[millencolin]

Power on the other hand, races his way from 2nd BACK to 8th, yet it was "changing conditions" or "unlucky pit strategy".


No it was because he kept cocking up the first corner. Simple.

[Marbles]

Danica despite 3 spins raced her way back to a top 10 finish. I think if she wasn't Danica we all would be applauding her for an incredible drive. If Paul Tracy spun 3 times and ended up in the top 10 what would our reactions be ? C'mon be honest !!



This is suppose to be big league motor sports -- not Tee-Ball. 3 spins and a tenth place finish well get most drivers a pretty frosty reception in the paddock. I don't consider that incredible. I don't even think PT's last to first at Cleveland last year was incredible. However, his last to first place charge at Road America a few years back without the aid of a caution.... now that was incredible!

I think Danica may deserve her spot on the grid but I think we should try and keep things in perspective. That is something the commentators have trouble doing.

[usgrandprix]

^^^^

heck of a post, usgrandprix.

Nice of you to say. Thanks.

My hope is that all the track time the teams will get at Indy will give the transition teams a chance to sort out the cars and we can start to see who is strong on ovals.

Bruno's got the stuff, we know. Servia seems to be holding his own. I hope a guy like Power can step up on ovals as he seems like a fun guy to follow. I have a feeling he will. Wilson seems poised to run for a championship in a year or so if he can sort them out and if NHL steps up as expected. Rahal has had his cage rattled unfortunately. I think he'll cruise through Kansas and use Indy to get confidence time. Hope it goes well for him. He'll have to push a bit if 39 show up. He should have a long talk with Marco, who has really impressed me this year after a lot of crazy stuff...well, up until the rookie error, which was probably due to him not realizing to compensate for a wet pit box.

Most of these guys are going for RoTY (http://www.indycar.com/stats/rookie_of_the_year.php?year=2008). Should be a good fight.

I just can't wait for ~26 cars at Richmond.

[garyshell]

Rahal has had his cage rattled unfortunately. I think he'll cruise through Kansas and use Indy to get confidence time.

Why are you so sure his confidence was shaken by the wreck?

Gary

[usgrandprix]

Why are you so sure his confidence was shaken by the wreck?

Gary

I guess I should clarify that it's speculative on my part and not based on anything he said. I should also say I hope it's not true, but...

1. He didn't race at Homestead and ESPN reported teams offered spare parts

2. The car/driver showed up fine for a test not a few days after the race

3. It was a hard hit and as far as I know that was his first impression of a high-speed oval (could be wrong, but I wouldn't guess a lot of experience). Seems like a logical reaction to be rattled a bit.

4. He's too young to have a body of experience in dealing with a wreck like that.

We'll see. Drivers are a different breed and I can't claim to understand them. Afterall, Bruno and Briscoe are coming back for more.

For whatever reason, I don't see Graham being the transition driver who competes earliest on ovals.

[F1boat]

What is unique about Indycar is that the winner of the series is the one who is the best overall on ovals and road courses. So far we saw that even with a new car Champ car teams are equal to Indy Car teams, while on ovals Indy car teams have an advantage. To me, nothing suggests that Champ Car teams are better overall.
We will see what happens at the end of the championship, but you must be aware that IRL and Champ Car were the two parts of a split championship, and never were too different, like F-1 or NASCAR. So it is not a surprise that N/H/L, which was a top-team before and after the split manages to win quickly. But can it mount a championship challenge to Ganassi, Penske and A/G/R?
We have to wait and see.

[nigelred5]

I'd like the think teh decision to hold GR out of Homestead was twofold. Primarily, for the TEAM to show that thery are not there simply because of handouts. That they can make it on their own without the need to solicit assistance from the other teams or the league itself, and are willing to sit one out. I also think it may have just as likely that they held him out to AVOID a confidence issue. If he didn't have one, what would have happended had he planted it hard into the barrier during the race? I think it was better to park him, get him more track time for him in an unfamiliar car and let him race in a more familiar surrounding where the stakes weren't so high. that was his first experience EVER on an oval as far as I can find, and he is only 19 afterall.

[garyshell]

I guess I should clarify that it's speculative on my part and not based on anything he said. I should also say I hope it's not true, but...

1. He didn't race at Homestead and ESPN reported teams offered spare parts

2. The car/driver showed up fine for a test not a few days after the race

3. It was a hard hit and as far as I know that was his first impression of a high-speed oval (could be wrong, but I wouldn't guess a lot of experience). Seems like a logical reaction to be rattled a bit.

4. He's too young to have a body of experience in dealing with a wreck like that.

We'll see. Drivers are a different breed and I can't claim to understand them. Afterall, Bruno and Briscoe are coming back for more.

For whatever reason, I don't see Graham being the transition driver who competes earliest on ovals.


I'll take the Newman Haas team explanation over the ESPN report any day. There may have been offers of parts, but were they of the same quality as the other "parts" given out initially? The team has a certain quality control protocol they go though, if the parts didn't make it through that or could not in a timely fashion they were not about to sacrifice their protocol for expediency. I applaud that.

Yes, the car was ready days latter that is days not hours. After it was up to THEIR standards.

Yes ,it was a hard hit and I am sure it rattled him, no doubt. But I am not sure it shook his confidence in any way. Look, I'll give you one guess who was the first person he talked to after he got out of the car. I am sure Bobby, pulled him aside and gave the proper assurances and guidance for Graham to not loose confidence. I am pretty sure the "fallen off the horse, back in the saddle" speech was given. You're right he has little oval experience of his own but he has a wealth of it at his ear.

Now, having said that, I do agree with you that I don't expect Graham to rise to the top on ovals immediately. But I am not going to use Homestead as a measure of Graham's confidence. I take Newman Haas at their word. Their attention to detail and carefully thought out protocol garnered them a lot of wins and championships. I have no doubt that had this happened AFTER they had had time to stockpile their own throughly scutineered parts that the car would have been on the track the next day.

Gary

[nanders]

I know we have Bruno and Oriel who have a fair body of oval work behind them already but I'll bet $5 that Graham Rahal is the first of the CC runners to score an oval win.

[usgrandprix]

Fair enough, Gary. I respect NHL immensely too and I should give them a bit more credit. Good point.

Like I said, just speculation. I'm willing to let any mystery about the situation go and give the benefit of the doubt. I was just talking about it in the context of rating the transition field on ovals. For whatever reason, he is one oval behind now and might need to spend some time getting comfortable again when Justin is dialing in the best ride height to be consistently fast over a 40-lap run.

May will be good for Graham. Lots of time and it's a good oval.

Still, there is a lot of work to do to set up a car for Indy and the driver has to be able to work closely with his team. I'll bet he's strong in that area even for his age given his heritage. Seems very mature and intelligent too.

He sure made some sweet passes at St. Petes, though. In places not many other drivers were passing. All smooth and smart too. That's got to help the confidence no matter what the venue.

He was on yesterday's daily video on the indycar site. The show is mostly goofy fluff, but he did mention that they need some wind tunnel time to get rid of the drag at ovals. Here's hoping he's not missing that "drag" trying to pass on the outside of turn 1 at Indy on cold tires.

[cartpix]

Most of these guys are going for RoTY (http://www.indycar.com/stats/rookie_of_the_year.php?year=2008). Should be a good fight.



Funny how things change. When Danica was a rookie, it was also the first year, in the IRL, for Patrick Carpeniter. Danica won ROY & Patrick had 10 more points.

Jeff

[BenRoethig]

I know we have Bruno and Oriel who have a fair body of oval work behind them already but I'll bet $5 that Graham Rahal is the first of the CC runners to score an oval win.

I don't doubt it, he has the best team behind him.

[usgrandprix]

Carpentier was not considered a rookie that year for the same reason Servia and Bruno are not this year. Prior oval experience.

Champ car hadn't raced on ovals for a while so there is a crop that must be considered rookies.

Doing otherwise would have actually been the inconsistent implementation of their rules, whether the rule itself is wise or not.

Of course no one has any business calling Wilson a rookie. But then, that's what they called Mansell at Indy too.

[xtlm]

Mansell won rookie of the year by 150 points!!!

[pvtjoker]

Rahal is the real deal as he proved last year and this past weekend. The CC teams haven't figured out the oval set-up but I don't think it'll take them as long as some thing. NHL will probably be up to speed by Indy. Just a hunch.

[CCWS77]

Lots of drivers run can run flat, in one groove, with the wings full, tp low, camber dragging, and fuel back for help out of the turn. They usually don't happen to be the ones you talk to at the end of the race.

The one you interview at the end of an oval race tends to be the one who can run a trimmed out car flat on cold tires, on worn tires, in multiple grooves, in changing conditions, full rich, light and heavy fuel, has fast pit ins (basically road course turns), can pass, can maintain momentum in traffic, can recover from the guaranteed bobble you will have, etc. And the one who knows just where his limit is and can communicate it to his team.

But the real point here is that not all ovals are the same. Texas, banking does too much work for the driver. Richmond, not so much. Motegi, asymmetric and brutal in race conditions.

Relatively it's more a question of tracks than cars at this point. The current Indycar requires more skill on ovals than any in the IRL series history if you go by reduced DF and lack of TC now. It's not your "grandma's" Indycar and to perpetuate the idea that it is does no favors to new fans and reveals ignorance or a willingness to compromise your true understanding of racing. If they are making steps toward lifting in and accelerating out of turns at Indy, and that's what you claim you want, then maybe you should be more positive when they are making strides toward that.

Historically there were plenty of driver's ovals, including Homestead at one point.

Lead lap is a big tell. There were 4 cars on the lead lap at the end of the race at Homestead (at a track I admit I don't really care for). It was a blistering pace with few yellows (the ultimate driver's aid). The point being that the oval racing at even cookie cutters is considerably more driver-dependent than it was just a few years ago.

Look how spread out they were even at the front. I think it's better racing and it's obvious. I think it's a shame to paint all oval racing with an absolute brush and not take notice at an evolution here or consider how varied ovals can be. I'd like to see more of a distinction from "other" forms of oval racing continue and be rewarded by the so-called knowledgeable fans so eventually there is no room for less than the best drivers in the world. We're not there yet, but to deny that there have been considerable steps toward it just turns it into a proxy argument about something else, really.

I liked St. Petes, but Graham won on fuel in a shortened race. Yes, he was racey and probably passed the most people and I look forward to seeing him do it again. But if the race had gone the distance, he would have had to have stopped when a bunch would not have had to. And AJ IV was on the lead lap. I really enjoyed it, too.

When people listen to what you want, more road courses and a harder car to drive, and you don't acknowledge it, people stop listening to you. How about helping give some fans a little power back in this equation rather than hurling broad falsehoods based on an agenda.

I happen to think that ovals are as big a loser in the whole split as anything. The rise of the Texases and Chicagos came at the cost of some ovals I really liked. Of course, NASCAR has a lot to do with that too.

What is interesting to me is that your post is a long admission that ovals with varied corners that arent cookie cutter foot to the floor racing are better and the pack racing idea is faulty, at least for open wheel cars. I dont know how it is you can type that long post (or anyone can read it) and it doesn't dawn on you that the ultimate expression of what you describe is good in a race course better matches Road America then any oval.

[usgrandprix]

What is interesting to me is that your post is a long admission that ovals with varied corners that arent cookie cutter foot to the floor racing are better and the pack racing idea is faulty, at least for open wheel cars. I dont know how it is you can type that long post (or anyone can read it) and it doesn't dawn on you that the ultimate expression of what you describe is good in a race course better matches Road America then any oval.

Oh, don't worry, I also happen to think some road courses are better than others too. Intesting you pick one of the premiere road courses in the world IMO. Of couse RA would be a preferred race for me over Homestead. That doesn't mean I would also choose the Streets of San Jose over Indy. But I'll take all four if it's good for the sport.

I also happen to think pure speed is part of the essence of racing. I don't expect all to, either. Just looking for a good mix of the best courses and cautioning against those who paint road or oval racing with broad strokes.

And, FWIW, there was no pack racing at Homestead, whether any of us like it or not.

[indycool]

I think the ex-CC guys will probably still be toward the back at Kansas, but Indy is a different story.

Indy has been around forever, and engineers and chief mechanics with experience at Indy have bounced from team to team and series to series throughout the split. There are Indy-experienced AND Dallara-experienced team members all over Indianapolis, and experienced engineers waiting by the phone. Some are also available because their previous teams no longer exist. Some are with Indy Lights teams and could help someone else out during the month.

IMO, much of the difference will come with the drivers. Will all of them adapt well to Indy? IMO, no. In the past, some have and some haven't and everything in between and I don't see any difference in that part now. Who will and who won't? The month of May will tell.

[ChicagocrewIRL]

I think the ex-CC guys will probably still be toward the back at Kansas, but Indy is a different story.

Indy has been around forever, and engineers and chief mechanics with experience at Indy have bounced from team to team and series to series throughout the split. There are Indy-experienced AND Dallara-experienced team members all over Indianapolis, and experienced engineers waiting by the phone. Some are also available because their previous teams no longer exist. Some are with Indy Lights teams and could help someone else out during the month.

IMO, much of the difference will come with the drivers. Will all of them adapt well to Indy? IMO, no. In the past, some have and some haven't and everything in between and I don't see any difference in that part now. Who will and who won't? The month of May will tell.


What about after Indy though ? We have nothing but ovals until July 6th .

[indycool]

It depends on who and what help, team-wise, they get in Indy that they KEEP for the rest of the series. And some drivers will be slower and some will be faster to adapt to those ovals than others.

[nanders]

........... So it is not a surprise that N/H/L, which was a top-team before and after the split manages to win quickly. But can it mount a championship challenge to Ganassi, Penske and A/G/R?
We have to wait and see.

It could play spoiler if nothing else, but I'm thinking these guys will be at the front of the oval grid before too long.