N4 cars may be permitted in WTCC

[mac853]

Hi, my name is "mac853", this is my 1st time to post a thread in this forum. In the case i saw in this site with a lot of great motorsport fans, specially for TCs, so i wish somebody to comment about this rumour which i found in portuguese site www.sportmotores.com (http://www.sportmotores.com)
Due the original is portuguese, so i have already a translated version here:

Apart from cars FIA S2000, future regulation of the FIA WTCC could accept cars Production N4. This idea, still in very embryonic stage, will have legs to walk in the future if it is welcomed by the manufacturers, after submitted by the Technical Commission of the FIA.
The vehicles of category N4 can be a bonus for the teams that still represented by private numbers relatively low. However, they are not planned any major changes in the regulation of the FIA WTCC before 2011, year in which provides for the introduction of turbo engines with low power.
This possibility, confirmed by Marcello Lotti to the British magazine Autosport and now raised to the FIA WTCC, comes weeks later, Morrie Chandler, the President of the Commission of the FIA Ralis, admitting publicly that the cars of two-wheel drive are "being study , "a clear indication to the viability of terms of two-wheel drive cars accepted as a reference in WRC.

Could anybody tell me if could be probably, then what type of cars could be, Subaru Impreza or Mitsubishi Evolution like rally?

[philipbain]

I very much doubt that a production class in WTCC would include the likes of Subaru and Mitsubishi. Going on the experience of the production class that used to run in the British Touring Car Championsip (it was a cheap way to fill grids at a time when there were less than a dozen cars were contesting the main championship) then it will typically consist of hatchback models from european manufacturers, typically smaller cars than the WTCC class cars.

The WTCC may benefit from an the extra variety that a production class would offer, the fact being that national series such as the BTCC offer more variety in terms of makes than the World Championship which perhaps reflects the comparitively poor coverage the WTCC gets vs. national series in thier respective countries. The fact is that despite Andy Priaulx winning the ETCC/WTCC 4 years in succession the BTCC has a much bigger following in the UK, the WTCC's main problem being Eurosport, who basically own the series, being very much a minority broadcaster in the UK. ITV4 now carry a 30 minute highlights program a week delayed from the races but compared to the full 5 hour BTCC live coverage that the same network offer it isnt surprising that the WTCC is marginalised.

[Daniel]

I very much doubt that a production class in WTCC would include the likes of Subaru and Mitsubishi. Going on the experience of the production class that used to run in the British Touring Car Championsip (it was a cheap way to fill grids at a time when there were less than a dozen cars were contesting the main championship) then it will typically consist of hatchback models from european manufacturers, typically smaller cars than the WTCC class cars.

The WTCC may benefit from an the extra variety that a production class would offer, the fact being that national series such as the BTCC offer more variety in terms of makes than the World Championship which perhaps reflects the comparitively poor coverage the WTCC gets vs. national series in thier respective countries. The fact is that despite Andy Priaulx winning the ETCC/WTCC 4 years in succession the BTCC has a much bigger following in the UK, the WTCC's main problem being Eurosport, who basically own the series, being very much a minority broadcaster in the UK. ITV4 now carry a 30 minute highlights program a week delayed from the races but compared to the full 5 hour BTCC live coverage that the same network offer it isnt surprising that the WTCC is marginalised.
Well if people just watch what there's more coverage on then it's their loss. Can count on one hand how many BTCC races I've watched on TV since I've been here (22 months) but I would say I've watched about 1/3 of the WTCC races simply due to it being a better series.

The thing about the Impreza's and Evo's is you can simply put a cage in, make a few small modiciations and you're away in a fairly powerful and fast car which isn't going to be the rolling roadblock that a lot of other production touring cars can tend to be.

[BDunnell]

As someone who finds the WTCC largely dull and uninteresting anyway — the supposed superiority of its line-up of drivers just doesn't ring true — I ought to be enthused about efforts to spice it up, but N4 cars are a complete non-starter. Any move like that smacks of desperation. It did so in the BTCC in 2000-2001 and it did so in other national championships before that.

[100%hondafan]

maybe to get grids up they should make it so independatds can only use 2 year old cars (would bring cost down as they seem to buy the latest cars every year) but if they want to develop there own car which is not a manufacture in the wtcc they can untill it is competitive.


but it would split race into to diffrent races eg race for manufactures and indies.

[mac853]

About the case BTCC are more popular in UK instead of WTCC, that's included the traditional career of BTCC eventually, undoubtly the racing rules are much more opened and fair than WTCC, mainly in the case of officials VS privateers, let's the privateer could remain with btc rules cars, some with own build S2000 cars, successfull for Honda and Vauxhall.

[mac853]

About N4 the cars mustn't have always advantage, as well in IRC.
Maybe FIA want do the same for WTCC to attracting more private tuners team with japanese manuf. support. Just because there's 2 rounds will be held there. I think even for Mitsubishi or Subaru, both them had enough experiences to face road races, in the case they have cars in Super Taikyu(Japan's N4 track race series).

[Daniel]

As someone who finds the WTCC largely dull and uninteresting anyway — the supposed superiority of its line-up of drivers just doesn't ring true — I ought to be enthused about efforts to spice it up, but N4 cars are a complete non-starter. Any move like that smacks of desperation. It did so in the BTCC in 2000-2001 and it did so in other national championships before that.

Well I think the opposite. Don't know why but the BTCC just hasn't done it for me since the Super Tourer days. Things like the wheel-of-grid-position-chosingness just added a tack factor that was unacceptable to me. But of course it's all opinion and you're free to be wrong :p

[Daniel]

maybe to get grids up they should make it so independatds can only use 2 year old cars (would bring cost down as they seem to buy the latest cars every year) but if they want to develop there own car which is not a manufacture in the wtcc they can untill it is competitive.


but it would split race into to diffrent races eg race for manufactures and indies.

Problem is how many independants are going to want to fork out all the money to run an old and in most cases uncompetitive car in a series that involves vast amounts of money shipping the car around the world. They'd be far better off playing around in a national championship. The result will be much the same but the costs involved will be a lot less.

[AndyRAC]

I very much doubt that a production class in WTCC would include the likes of Subaru and Mitsubishi. Going on the experience of the production class that used to run in the British Touring Car Championsip (it was a cheap way to fill grids at a time when there were less than a dozen cars were contesting the main championship) then it will typically consist of hatchback models from european manufacturers, typically smaller cars than the WTCC class cars.

The WTCC may benefit from an the extra variety that a production class would offer, the fact being that national series such as the BTCC offer more variety in terms of makes than the World Championship which perhaps reflects the comparitively poor coverage the WTCC gets vs. national series in thier respective countries. The fact is that despite Andy Priaulx winning the ETCC/WTCC 4 years in succession the BTCC has a much bigger following in the UK, the WTCC's main problem being Eurosport, who basically own the series, being very much a minority broadcaster in the UK. ITV4 now carry a 30 minute highlights program a week delayed from the races but compared to the full 5 hour BTCC live coverage that the same network offer it isnt surprising that the WTCC is marginalised.

As long as the WTCC stays on Eurosport then I'm afraid it will continue to be marginalised. How a National Championship can get far more coverage than a World Championship doesn't seem right to me. Having watched the 30min highlight show, it was almost like watching the Seat Cupra Cup series. Not sure that looks good for a World Championship.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Well I think the opposite. Don't know why but the BTCC just hasn't done it for me since the Super Tourer days. Things like the wheel-of-grid-position-chosingness just added a tack factor that was unacceptable to me. But of course it's all opinion and you're free to be wrong :p

BTCC may not be what it was but even with it's wheel-of-grid-position thing it's still far more acceptable than the WTCC and its 'equivalency formula'.

[racer69]

I like the idea to be honest.

Remember the very first WTCC was a three-class championship.

[Daniel]

BTCC may not be what it was but even with it's wheel-of-grid-position thing it's still far more acceptable than the WTCC and its 'equivalency formula'.
Well they have success ballast in the BTCC too anyway so I don't see the difference :) Both of the series penalise good drivers/teams which is just stupid.

Thing is you look at the entry list to the WTCC and there are former formula 1 drivers and a heap of ex- BTCC champions. Then I look at the BTCC entry list and see a few excellent drivers and then a lot of guys who would probably be nowhere if the level of compeition was anywhere near where it was in the supertourer days.

[BDunnell]

Well they have success ballast in the BTCC too anyway so I don't see the difference :) Both of the series penalise good drivers/teams which is just stupid.

Thing is you look at the entry list to the WTCC and there are former formula 1 drivers and a heap of ex- BTCC champions. Then I look at the BTCC entry list and see a few excellent drivers and then a lot of guys who would probably be nowhere if the level of compeition was anywhere near where it was in the supertourer days.

Stick a lot of those WTCC drivers in the BTCC and I bet they wouldn't dominate. We've seen how Tom Coronel struggled desperately when he had a go last year.

And the Super Touring days weren't necessarily any less competitive than now. In 1994 there were 10 manufacturers involved in the BTCC with works entries. Of those, four - Mazda, Nissan, Toyota and Volvo - weren't in with a hope of winning a race, and Peugeot were but didn't.

[mac853]

I like the idea to be honest.

Remember the very first WTCC was a three-class championship.
Yeah, but that WTCC is another kind with same name, i never saw before, but what could i heard from experienced commentator meant is a failed 1 organized by FIA. As he explained that is totally boring, with long distance race, GRA spec car with GT race distance. The car drivers are changeable and the number of teams are poor.
But i think FIA don't want to make also as BTCC did in some years ago,allow SP cars to fill grid like to have better look, just because the private teams don't want afford too much budget on that expensive BTC cars.
FIA just want to creating a "bridge" to try syncronizing S2000 and N4, but everything is still in research. About the price, i think N4 could be a good point, but from the beginning will be very little of numbers due the lack of competitiveness, as PWRC has now only 2 Peugeot, but hope later will included more S2000 like Fiat.
Like in WTCC "FWD VS RWD", each cars have his advantage on different circuits.