RacinJason Column [Archive] - Motorsport Forums

bt52b

29th March 2008, 19:10

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00460/Jason_Plato_460277a.jpg

HI, I’m Jason Plato and welcome to my exclusive column with The Sun.
This is my fifth season racing with SEAT Sport UK in the British Touring Car Championship.
I reckon it’s the best team in the series, because we race hard and have a lot of fun off the track.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article967890.ece

VX_Rules

29th March 2008, 19:39

Why on earth have they got him doing Columns?

SEATFreak

30th March 2008, 08:16

Why on earth have they got him doing Columns?

Why not? What do you think could stop him?

speedy king

30th March 2008, 13:49

Its publicity for the general public end of the day, dont see why people get so touchy :s

tyreman2

30th March 2008, 18:36

Why on earth have they got him doing Columns?
Let me think......... He is a bloody good driver,A very good communicator,A touring car super star,A TV personality.A sponsor's dream. Need i go on?

VX_Rules

30th March 2008, 22:40

He has already slagged off half the field in that first column, pathetic man...

Mp3 Astra

30th March 2008, 23:10

He has already slagged off half the field in that first column, pathetic man...

Where has he insulted anyone? He said Chilton had a poor 2007, which is true, and said a few others have a lot to prove. He said that there were some mobile chicanes (ie slower drivers), which is true, and he didn't name anybody!

SEATFreak

31st March 2008, 08:14

He has already slagged off half the field in that first column, pathetic man...

"Gordon Shedden will be the top Honda driver in his Team Halfords Civic"

"Mat Jackson has been the quickest in pre-season testing. The 2006 SEAT Cupra Champion made his BTCC debut last year and even though it’s a family-run team, Mat will be mega-quick in his ex-Andy Priaulx WTCC winning BMW."

"I also have a lot of respect for Fabrizio Giovanardi, the guy that beat me to the title last year.

He’s one of those top professional drivers who you can race side-by-side with and you know it will be a good, clean and spectacular fight."

"Mike and Andrew Jordan make an interesting father-son two car team, and their Honda Integras have both been quick in testing."

Perhaps Jase should slag more people of then. Because other than Chilton who was poor he mentioned no other driver.

bt52b

31st March 2008, 14:42

Chilton wasn't great at Brands either.

? - Why do other BTCC drivers keep such a low profile? Jason does a fair bit of radio, tv and other media besides, but none of the others seems to be as competitive in the media game.

VX_Rules

31st March 2008, 16:23

Mp3 Astra

1st April 2008, 01:49

He said, that half the field might as well stay at home, and shouldnt be allowed to drive fairground dodgems, let alone touring cars.
Sorry that I don't like the man, and I know he has a huge following, but he shouldn't get as much press as he does becuase it's making the BTCC turn into the Jason Plato Show.

"And also some not-so-good mobile chicanes who really shouldn’t be let loose in fairground dodgems, let alone a touring car. "

He said "some" not "half the field".

JP is a cool customer, and there isn't really a problem with him being a significant profile in the BTCC. After all, statistically he is the most successful driver in BTCC history (in terms of wins); racing for one of the biggest teams and is already a decent journalist. Why not have him as the star - at the end ofthe day a column soley about the BTCC in one of the UK's most popular papers should do the series a lot of good!

Les

1st April 2008, 06:23

all I can say is that if he starts slagging off people for no good reason then he had better watch out!

SEATFreak

1st April 2008, 09:22

He said "some" not "half the field".

He didn't even mention personally those "some" to boot.

How can you take offence and being slagged of in an article when your name is nowhere to be seen?

AndySpeed

1st April 2008, 11:39

I wonder just how much editing that column had before it went to press...

Not a bad column and the way it's written seems to me to be aiming to open up the BTCC to new audiences which is always a good thing. Just a pity it's in the Sun.

Winchester

1st April 2008, 12:41

SEATFreak

1st April 2008, 14:53

It amazes me how much stick the guy gets.
VX Rules, you're criticising him for things he hasn't actually said!
He is giving the BTCC yet more coverage, this time in the country's top selling newspaper. What's the problem with that? Would you rather it was meek, PR-friendly and opinionless? Because if it was, it wouldn't be worth reading.
Plato knows how to play the game and I'm sure he's well aware that all publicity for the BTCC is good publicity.

I still recall strongly the Newcastle Quayside demo.

I still vividly remember Jase' saying to a reporter for a local TV station that BTCC drivers aren't like F1 drivers in that their career isn't wrapped in cotton wool (by that I assume he meant not by protocol) and that they are more open to the public.

Surely if your a motorsport championship that prides itself on being open to the public, publicity is vital. The publicity attracta the people that your drivers want to be open with.

I have heard several times that touring cars don't have the profile of F1 or the WRC and we have to accept it, but it seems when people try to do something that improves the profile of tintops and makes it popular they get criticised.

Winchester

1st April 2008, 15:18

BDunnell

1st April 2008, 23:22

SEATFreak

2nd April 2008, 08:29

Could'nt agree more SEATFreak, I think it's called cutting off your nose to spite your face! The fact the BTCC is in the Sun at all is fantastic.
Plus there are other stories on the BTCC linked at the side of Plato's column which is also good.

Absolutely. I see no negatives in it whatsoever.

Than you guys! Course I am right! How can you not further peoples understanding of the BTCC without it? I am sure most of not all regions with a cicuit on the BTCC programme advertise on local TV the up-coming meeting and theirs items on the sport segment in the regional magazine programme, but whilst attracting people to buy tickets is one thing, it is quite another to educate people as to what it is their watching, the rules like the success ballast, the points system and who the teams and drivers are.

Did you know The Sun is the paper with the highest circulation of any English-language newspaper in the UK and RoI, standing at just over 3m copies and with a daily readership of 5 million in the C2DE demograihic compared to the 1m of the upmarket The Times in the same demographic? To anyone that doesn't know the National Readership Survey (NRS) social grades are a system of demographic classification. C2 is the "skilled working class" (foreman, farmer, plumber, bricklayer), D is the "working class" (Mannual worker, shop worker, fisherman, apprentices) and E is the "underclass" (casual labourers and pensioners). Makes sense surely if you want to be a column writer you go with the paper that targets the mainstream.

Rememer when Mat Neal went on Chris Evans' Drive Time on Radio 2 last year? Did you know R2 is one of the most popular stations in the UK and beats to 1st in all regions all regional stations? I think Mat would have not reached the amount of people he did if he went to a less popular station.

Don't worry, Jase knows what he is doing VXR!

bt52b

2nd April 2008, 16:14

http://www.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00458/RACIN__JASON_458985a.jpg

RacinJason (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason) Part Two
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason
Great day's work in opening race

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00462/crash_682x400_462006a.jpg
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article986979.ece

VX_Rules

2nd April 2008, 18:12

The Quote: Great days work.
The Picture: A massive shunt, on purpose or not, was created by Plato.

:/

Iain

2nd April 2008, 19:18

It's a decent column, nice to read something that isn't a press release laced with the usual cliches.

SEATFreak

2nd April 2008, 19:39

Exaxctly. And it is straight from the horses mouth. No saying what everyone thinks he should say.

Wish I was more like him! :p :

bt52b

12th April 2008, 14:23

rock' preview
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article1024193.ece

Mp3 Astra

12th April 2008, 15:29

Jason in Ready Steady Cook? This I have to see! :D

bt52b

12th April 2008, 19:50

Jason in Ready Steady Cook? This I have to see! :D

Don't think its been on yet and not scheduled next week as far as I can see. Should be fun :D

bt52b

17th April 2008, 01:28

OUR race weekend at Rockingham didn’t quite go according to plan.
No, that’s a bit of an understatement.

The trouble with starting in the middle of the pack is that you run the risk of being behind Tom Chilton....
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article1049647.ece

SEATFreak

17th April 2008, 08:16

It was a disaster but we'll be back

Now I am much happier! Thanks Jase! :up:

It reminded me of misspent days with Scalextric

So does watching Tom Chilton!

jackmarsh

17th April 2008, 14:27

`I think Jason fancies Tom, he's like a boy who is nasty to a girl during the age of 13/14 cos he actually likes her. The fact of the matter is that Jason has hit Tom probably 5 times to every 1 time Tom has hit him. The unfortunate thing about Plato is he has had the best car for 2/3 years, and hasn't won the championship, and the way he drove at Rockingham, knocking into people was the signs of a man who knows he's not going to win in for another year.

I wish he would stop publicly insulting other drivers, it is extremely unprofessional, and makes him look the 'plonker.' if he wants to be taken seriously then his driving moves on other people need to be improved, and greatly, otherwise people will treat him in the same manner. Just remember he turned Tom into the pit wall at Silverstone a few years back, the guy is desperate.

VX_Rules

17th April 2008, 15:05

Plato's unbelievably pathetic and I think Tom has summed him up well with this comment:

"He needs to grow up, stop being a cry baby, and start taking responsibility for his own actions."

Words elude me for how to describe Plonker Plato.

SEATFreak

17th April 2008, 15:23

The fact of the matter is that Jason has hit Tom probably 5 times to every 1 time Tom has hit him.

Yeah. And Tom has the bruises to show for it! :p :

The unfortunate thing about Plato is...

....he has been too kind on Chilton. :p :

knocking into people was the signs of a man who knows he's not going to win in for another year.

Remind me how Mat Neal won the title two years running?

the guy is desperate.

I just don't think he is someone who is prepared to not take things lying down. You said yourself for 2 years he has had the best car and not won the title once (now do you all see where I am coming from?). It is so easy for a lesser person to just lie down with head in hands and cry himself to sleep. I would. Not Jason Plato. One day he will. It may not be anytime before the moon hosts the FIFA World Cup; but it will happen.

jackmarsh

17th April 2008, 15:36

Seatfreak, there is no questioning how much you support Seat, but do you think that slagging off a fellow driver in the series in a national news paper is a professional thing to do?

I think some of your points are valid, but if you remember Matt Neal won the first title by finishing almost if not all the races, therefore he can't have been bashing people left right and centre.

However I do agree that Matt has his fare share of dirting driving moves, but who doesn't, I just think that Jason needs to use his head, as a role model, and not slag off drivers when things go wrong, he had a bad weekend, but he'll be back for Donny.

All I want to see as a fan of the touring cars is a little more professionalism, and as a friend of Tom, I find insults in the national press a little too much.

SEATFreak

18th April 2008, 08:21

do you think that slagging off a fellow driver in the series in a national news paper is a professional thing to do?

Depends on the grounds being brutally honest and whether or not I am in a stronger position than Jase' to judge; which I clearly am not in this case. And to be brutally honest I am yet to think of a position where I could possibly be in a stronger position than a driver to judge on any situation.

Unless you are I think it could be a good idea if you just take him/her at his/her word until you can prove him/her wrong.

But to make debate's about the rights and wrongs of a racing move fairer and give your good friend Tom a chance to answer the accusations, it may be a good idea for The Sun to publish a small article giving ANY driver Jase' is criticising that chance to reply. Like Casio, The Sun only sponsor the team. They have no reason to act all partisan.

But as it happens my only 'sensible' view is that I don't think it matter greatly at the end of the day. Because Tom's 7th in race 2 beat JP's 9th and Tom's 4th beat JP's 2pts.

Les

18th April 2008, 08:47

I have to say I am getting fed up of the slanging matches.... it's as if it is orchestrated.
Last year it was the Neals v Plato this year Plato v Chilton....

grow the up the lot of them

bt52b

18th April 2008, 10:09

"He made two schoolboy errors," Chilton told Autosport.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/66690

AndySpeed

18th April 2008, 14:05

I think some of your points are valid, but if you remember Matt Neal won the first title by finishing almost if not all the races, therefore he can't have been bashing people left right and centre.

However I do agree that Matt has his fare share of dirting driving moves, but who doesn't, I just think that Jason needs to use his head, as a role model, and not slag off drivers when things go wrong, he had a bad weekend, but he'll be back for Donny.

http://www.btccaction.co.uk/drivers/neal_results.php

Neal was only outside the top 10 on 3 occasions in his two championship winning years, and they were retirements. Granted today's grids are larger and more competitive, but Giovanardi was only outside the top 10 twice last year (http://www.btccaction.co.uk/drivers/giovanardi_results.php) and lower than fifth 5 times. Combined with 10 wins.

Thus Jason Plato will not be 2008 champion already, in my opinion.

bt52b

18th April 2008, 23:56

Thus Jason Plato will not be 2008 champion already, in my opinion.

Think you may be right, they should have been quick straight away. Almost starting to look like a development year... Did SEAT UK do much pre-season teating?

SEATFreak

19th April 2008, 08:43

Thus Jason Plato will not be 2008 champion already, in my opinion.

No...really?!! That is a shock! :p :

That is probably the least shocking news I have ever heard. I knew he was not going to be champion before the season started. For as long as VXR in the BTCC it is unlikely he will become champion. Painfully sad for me to admit it, but true. Alan Gow would need to suspend VXR for a season before we see a level playing field achieved and before we see a champion that doesn't drive for VXR in a time where VXR have a very good car.

So whatever Jase' says in his column that offends you I suggest perhaps you think "On the other hand, for all his criticisms will Jason Plato actually reap any rewards this season?", because for as long as VXR are racing I just don't think anyone has a chance; most of all Jase'.

VX_Rules

19th April 2008, 09:01

MBailey06

19th April 2008, 09:21

Considering at Donington last year, Plato dominated and Giovanardi had a shocker, don't rule out Plato this season, yet.

SEATFreak

19th April 2008, 10:38

Im sorry, but VXR and Seat are both manufacturers, it would be unfair to suspend VXR for a season, thats just an unbeleivably stupid Idea, If Seat want to get anywhere, they need better drivers, a car with proper testing, and throw a little more money in. This is touring cars, not F1, its not as if they need to throw in Rediculous amounts, what seems to them anyway.

How could you think I am too stupid to realise it an unbelivably supid idea?

I cannot believe I am having to point it out, but as you mistakenly put your own spin on my statement's meaning, the fact is was such a stupid idea clearly means it was not said a serious suggestion when I said VXR would need to be suspended for a season. That is what would need to have to happen for a team to rip a strong VXR's stranglehold over the BTCC such is the strength of the stranglehold.

And Jase' for all his critisicms of others certainly I don't think will never win the title with SEAT so try not to be too hard on Jase when he writes his article.

AndySpeed

19th April 2008, 11:50

And Jase' for all his critisicms of others certainly I don't think will never win the title with SEAT so try not to be too hard on Jase when he writes his article.

With that double negative I'm assuming you believe he will win the championship soon.

Iain

19th April 2008, 12:39

How on earth have VXR got a stranglehold on the BTCC? Don't you remember 2005 and 2006 SEATFreak?

It's not as if they're doing anything wrong either, they just have a base car that is more suited to racing than the Leon is. Roles were reversed when SEAT had the Toledo and VXR the Astra SportHatch remember.

VX_Rules

19th April 2008, 15:53

Im sorry that I get confused by ur mistakable jibber jabber.

SEATFreak

28th April 2008, 08:24

With that double negative I'm assuming you believe he will win the championship soon.

WTF is a double negative?! :laugh:

Have you been spending too much time on Encarta Andy? :)

How on earth have VXR got a stranglehold on the BTCC? Don't you remember 2005 and 2006 SEATFreak?

Course I do. I cannot believe you think I don't. It was only about 4 years ago the earliest of the two. I cannot remember where I mentioned it and it could be on the SCN website for all I know, but I did mention the mini drought where they won only one of the available titles in two years (2005-2006).

But we all know what happened then! After the two years they had the car where they only won the one available title (Manufacturers - 2005) they quickly woke up and got shot of it, changing to the Vectra where you will find normal service was resumed in 2007 winning both the Drivers and Manufacturers title.

It shows just how powerful they are that it takes a very poor car at VXR for other teams to overtake them.

It will be quite a while before we see a rival outfit beat a VXR whilst strong at the same time and keep on beating them consistently. For as long as VXR and 888 want to do the BTCC I fear we may never see a change in the top team in the BTCC.

Dave B

28th April 2008, 13:34

WTF is a double negative?! :laugh:

We don't need no education... ;)

BDunnell

28th April 2008, 21:50

We don't need no education... ;)

I ain't got no idea what you're going on about.

SEATFreak

29th April 2008, 08:44

I ain't got no idea what you're going on about.

Nice one!

Judging by the attitude of many forum members I think what our Dave is trying to say is "we don't need to be told anything as we know it all."

I wonder why I get the feeling I would have gotten my hand smacked like a naughty little boy had I said that...

Atleast now I have cracked it. If I want to say something sarcastic but true to someone but not get into any trouble...just get someone else to say it!

BDunnell

29th April 2008, 10:23

SEATFreak, I think you misunderstand again...

AndyRAC

29th April 2008, 10:46

I would think that Vauxhall probably plough more money into their BTCC effort than Seat. The BTCC is the only 'high profile' Motorsport that they take part in. Seat have also got the WTCC to consider. To Vauxhall, the BTCC is everything. Which is why I'm not a big fan of theirs - they dip in and out of the BRC only when they feel like - yet stay with the BTCC no matter what the regs.

BDunnell

29th April 2008, 10:49

AndyRAC

29th April 2008, 11:08

Vauxhall alone couldn't have saved the BRC. And GM's commitment to British rallying over the course of more than 20 years cannot be faulted.

No, I'm aware of that. It's just that when the 4WD came in they up and left, then towards the end of F2 re-entered, then left when the WRCars were allowed. I am aware of their history in the sport; Bertie, Jimmy, Pentti; Chuvit, Mantta, Astra, etc. I may be wrong but they 've obviously decided that Rallying is no longer for them. ( Actually who could blame them) It's me being petty and finding a reason to dislike them.

Dave B

29th April 2008, 12:31

Vauxhall alone couldn't have saved the BRC. .
Indeed. All in all they'd have just been another brick in the wall. :p

SEATFreak

29th April 2008, 13:15

Seat have also got the WTCC to consider.

What about the factory at the team level?

I don't think we know if the team that competes in the BTCC and the team that competes in the WTCC, have any ties to each other in one shape or form.

Obviously two (I think two) of the 5 WTCC cars are ORECA (Muller & Tarquini) and I think the other 3 (Rydell, Gene and Monteiro) are with some other people and SEATSportUK are I know 100% is run by NorthernSouth.

But I don't know if they have any ties that means money can be shared.

jackmarsh

29th April 2008, 17:14

What are you going on about?? Sometimes I have to wonder, do you get the hints of the double negatives going on here, or are you babbling on about something else and getting people to say it for you??

Alfa Fan

29th April 2008, 17:25

SEATFreak, I think you misunderstand again...

He's like a dog chases his own tail. So close yet so far.

BDunnell

29th April 2008, 20:22

He's like a dog chases his own tail. So close yet so far.

I thought I'd save us a bit of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_negative

Iain

29th April 2008, 21:10

Ahh yes Double Negative, or as I call him - Mark Blundell.

BDunnell

29th April 2008, 21:59

Ahh yes Double Negative, or as I call him - Mark Blundell.

:laugh:

"Well, Steve, I 'ave to say, I ain't seen nothing wrong with what David Coulfard done..."

SEATFreak

30th April 2008, 09:07

CroftPilgrim

30th April 2008, 13:24

SEATFreak

30th April 2008, 15:28

It's called humour. It seems some people could do to have a little bit more of it around here.....

Don't know if your taking about me not having any but I am the best case example. I have tried to make plenty of innocent jokes that have been deliberately taken out of context as some serious accusation.

Remember when I said about Tom Onslow Cole's move to VXR?
Jimmy Magnussen said he thought Ian (Harrison) is being handed "a nice pile of green stuff to run TOC". I made a joke at the expense of my own naivety over who is funding TOC by making it sound like it was a mystery. I asked who it was and I thought it was all very "Inspector Cluseau" to me and that I was expecting to find a top Cuban crime lord at the heart of it all. Tdb totally took it out of context as some allegation and a stupid post.

I feel sorry for Jase I really do. Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. Whatever he does it is wrong. Like people here are ideal role models! Makes me wanna puke!

tin-top fan

30th April 2008, 22:42

Don't know if your taking about me not having any but I am the best case example. I have tried to make plenty of innocent jokes that have been deliberately taken out of context as some serious accusation.

As someone (Jimbob I think?) said in another thread, please stop playing the innocent card SEATFreak!!!!!! Why do you have to turn every thread into being about how persecuted you are on the forum?!?

tyreman2

30th April 2008, 23:02

Attempting to bring some modicum of comprehensibe sense back to this tread I thought I would post this on seatcupra.net

http://www.seatcupra.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=863&Itemid=1

So whatever problems rivals are posing for SEAT and seemingly Jase in particular, as much of false dawn it could be it looks like things could possibly be looking up. According to the article it looks like in FARO Technologies SEAT have a name that may possibly be charged with the job of improving something about what could be the engineering of a better Leon at it's assembly level, in as much as the parts will be analysed in 3D.

I hope the partnership works. Fingers crossed.

I also hope that FARO's expertise will help the SEAT challenge,but i don't see any need to over complicate matters

1 SEAT had to change to diesel because the petrol car was to slow in a straight line (Adam Jones was almost slowest across the start finish line at Rockingham, and they dont lift of till turn 2 braking zone that s a long way to be flat out)
2 SEAT where not allowed the flat floor ala WTCC

3 the introduction of the Diesel has caused a lot of understeer in the car

4 excessive understeer creates more tyre wear which creates more understeer

Once they have found a cure for the understeer they will be winning races

North and South do have connections with the factory, 2-3 personnel attend each BTCC race,but they are by no means an arm of SEAT (Espania)

My personal oppinion is for SEAT to win the BTCC they need to take the cars away from N+S and make a fresh start with another team.

SEATFreak

1st May 2008, 09:24

I also hope that FARO's expertise will help the SEAT challenge,but i don't see any need to over complicate matters.

In what way "overcomplicate matters"? It clear that all this constant introducing of new things is taking a toll on me (I am getting a little frustrated), but at the back of my mind is this view that is is perhaps a necessary evil.

It equally clear that since as they are now they are in no position to overtake VXR, in order for SEATSportUK to establish and maintain a stronger position than VXR they must not stop until they have tried and tested all the things that are better and more efficient that what VXR has so that SEAT can advance their position so it betters that of VXR.

My personal oppinion is for SEAT to win the BTCC they need to take the cars away from N+S and make a fresh start with another team.

But who? Who would want to take on SEAT?

AndySpeed

1st May 2008, 10:02

But who? Who would want to take on SEAT?

Who would want relative financial security, backing and support from a works outfit? I should imagine there are quite a few parties who would jump at the chance.

CroftPilgrim

1st May 2008, 10:24

Don't know if your taking about me not having any but I am the best case example.

Don't worry SEATFreak, I wasn't referring to you!

Another point - I get tired of the driver bashing that goes on on this forum particularly as most of it is borne out of ignorance. I know Jason is a member of this forum (along with many other drivers) and if we want them to contribute we perhaps ought to be more positive and respectful.

AndySpeed

1st May 2008, 12:23

Don't worry SEATFreak, I wasn't referring to you!

Another point - I get tired of the driver bashing that goes on on this forum particularly as most of it is borne out of ignorance. I know Jason is a member of this forum (along with many other drivers) and if we want them to contribute we perhaps ought to be more positive and respectful.

To be honest using Jason as an example probably wasn't the best one as he doesn't read the forums these days.

Congratulations to Plato though, as he's now a dad!

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article1108787.ece

SEATFreak

1st May 2008, 13:39

Who would want relative financial security, backing and support from a works outfit? I should imagine there are quite a few parties who would jump at the chance.

Who would not want to not play second fiddle to VXR for years to come?

Quite a few. But who of those could do it at SEAT? Now there is a question.

tyreman2

1st May 2008, 15:02

As i said in my earlier comment it may take one more race/test for them to cure the problem,(for all we know they may have it sussed already)so for you to say they will play second fiddle for years to come is being very pessimistic.

My problem with N+T is wether they are capable of putting together a sustained effort? something they havn't managed to do in previous seasons.You are right SEAT FREAK in that there does seem to be an unsettled atmosphere in the camp and that needs sorting for the team to improve.

Who would not want to not play second fiddle to VXR for years to come?

Quite a few. But who of those could do it at SEAT? Now there is a question.

SEATFreak

1st May 2008, 16:48

so for you to say they will play second fiddle for years to come is being very pessimistic.

Just being honest. I look at Vauxhall and all I seem to see is a team who cannot be beat so long as they are strong. The Integra did look a far and genuinely superior car to the Sport Hatch in 2005 & 2006. That is why Vauxhall wasn't for me the top team in those years. But once they began using the Vectra they pretty much re-assumed their position they held before the Sport Hatch and with the Astra Coupe.

My problem with N+T is wether they are capable of putting together a sustained effort? something they havn't managed to do in previous seasons.You are right SEAT FREAK in that there does seem to be an unsettled atmosphere in the camp and that needs sorting for the team to improve.

I don't think either they seem initially capable of putting together a sustained effort with the right things. But rather than an "unsettled atmosphere", I must admit and in hindsight it does seem to be more of a case where NorthernSouth are perhaps panicking a bit to find an answer to the questions VXR pose rather than trying everything in sight and when it doesn't work out get rid and quickly bring in a replacement with the hope it does better.

But for me it ain't as if Grant & Ian's NorthernSouth are a rubbish team. They just don't seem to be a very calm outfit at the moment.

In the words of Kevin Keegan "I would absolutely LOVE IT" if ORECA came on board though. But it is very likely a dream.

tyreman2

1st May 2008, 18:35

Just being honest. I look at Vauxhall and all I seem to see is a team who cannot be beat so long as they are strong. The Integra did look a far and genuinely superior car to the Sport Hatch in 2005 & 2006. That is why Vauxhall wasn't for me the top team in those years. But once they began using the Vectra they pretty much re-assumed their position they held before the Sport Hatch and with the Astra Coupe.

I don't think either they seem initially capable of putting together a sustained effort with the right things. But rather than an "unsettled atmosphere", I must admit and in hindsight it does seem to be more of a case where NorthernSouth are perhaps panicking a bit to find an answer to the questions VXR pose rather than trying everything in sight and when it doesn't work out get rid and quickly bring in a replacement with the hope it does better.
NBut for me it ain't as if Grant & Ian's NorthernSouth are a rubbish team. They just don't seem to be a very calm outfit at the moment.

In the words of Kevin Keegan "I would absolutely LOVE IT" if ORECA came on board though. But it is very likely a dream.

Not sure I follow what your saying Old friend,do you mean they should get rid of the Tdi or be like VXR and persevere untill they get it right By the way VXR's budget is about 3 times NorthernSouth's if not more

SEATFreak

2nd May 2008, 08:29

Not sure I follow what your saying Old friend,do you mean they should get rid of the Tdi or be like VXR and persevere untill they get it right By the way VXR's budget is about 3 times NorthernSouth's if not more

I don't just mean the TDi; I mean every new thing they introduce into the team. But I do believe despite my initial pecimism I DO still think they should persevere with the TDi (they certainly cannot go back now). But then I am saying persevere with everything and not to introduce to many things too regularly.

For instance they got on board Dave Ward as Team Manager. This only a year after recruiting Jonathan Haynes. Which is only a year on from recruiting Doug Bebb. Ward is very good and maybe Scott Dennis was right to dispense with Haynes and recruit Ward. But why? And why only a year after recruiting his predecessor?

I don't doubt the competence of the things they have in the setup like the TDi because I am sure it will come good eventualy (we just don't know when). SEAT, for all their difference in budget compared to VXR, have got very good quality things in the team. I just worry about the regularity it seems at which Scott introduces new things into the setup and why.

jonv

2nd May 2008, 11:06

Who would want relative financial security, backing and support from a works outfit? I should imagine there are quite a few parties who would jump at the chance.

GR Asia would seem to be a good choice

SEATFreak

2nd May 2008, 13:24

GR Asia would seem to be a good choice

Too much experience of being an Independent and not enough running a factory outfit. They are more in the vein of a WSR or a TD than a 888, ORECA, Schnitzer or RML.

BDunnell

2nd May 2008, 13:50

Too much experience of being an Independent and not enough running a factory outfit. They are more in the vein of a WSR or a TD than a 888, ORECA, Schnitzer or RML.

What does WSR have if not long experience of being a factory outfit, with Ford, Honda and MG?

AndySpeed

2nd May 2008, 14:07

"Too much experience of being an Independent"

:laugh: What a thing to say!

WSR have more experience running a works team than Northern South do!

SEATFreak

2nd May 2008, 16:17

WSR have more experience running a works team than Northern South do!

:laugh: What a thing to say!

I haven't been into the BTCC as long as you have!

I have been watching since 2001...how long have you been watching?! :laugh:

BDunnell

2nd May 2008, 16:46

:laugh: What a thing to say!

I haven't been into the BTCC as long as you have!

I have been watching since 2001...how long have you been watching?! :laugh:

A quick word of friendly advice - it is possible to find out about things that happened before you started watching it, you know. Then you might avoid saying things that cause people to, quite understandably, react in that way.

AndySpeed

2nd May 2008, 17:06

:laugh: What a thing to say!

I haven't been into the BTCC as long as you have!

I have been watching since 2001...how long have you been watching?! :laugh:

Well SEATFreak I have been watching since about 1995, went to my first BTCC meeting in 1997, joined this forum two years before you did and have read a lot about BTCC team and driver history through working on my own website. I'm by far not the most knowledgable person about the BTCC on here but I do know a bit about West Surrey Racing's past.

Alfa Fan

2nd May 2008, 17:43

By the way VXR's budget is about 3 times NorthernSouth's if not more

But thats partly explained by the fact that VXR are building and developing their own cars, unlike SEAT Sport UK.

tyreman2

2nd May 2008, 18:01

But thats partly explained by the fact that VXR are building and developing their own cars, unlike SEAT Sport UK.

Not so 888 build and develop the cars as do NothernSouth with there SEAT's
Where there is a huge difference is that 888's budget probably comes from the manufacturer,and my guess is NorthernSouth's comes from the UK dealer network.

Alfa Fan

2nd May 2008, 18:25

Yeah but you cannot argue that Northern South have more or equal amount of work compared to Triple Eight?

AndySpeed

2nd May 2008, 19:43

I haven't been into the BTCC as long as you have!

Espeically for you SEATFreak:

http://www.btccaction.co.uk/teams/wsr.php

Enjoy!

tyreman2

3rd May 2008, 01:43

Yeah but you cannot argue that Northern South have more or equal amount of work compared to Triple Eight?

I agree, I am sure the directive to both teams is Win races, coz race wins bring Championship trophies.VXR/888 have a good understanding of how the race dept works as opposed to the needs of the marketing people,with SEAT Sport UK I am not so sure,after all Scott is employed by the marketing Dept not the race team.

SEATFreak

3rd May 2008, 08:26

Yeah but you cannot argue that Northern South have more or equal amount of work compared to Triple Eight?

Your point? :confused:

NS may have as much if not more work to do than 888, but surely it is what both get in return from that work that matters. And as we have seen in the past 8 years 888 have gotten a little bit more in return from that work per year than NS have since they made their competitive debut.

SEAT have won since 2005 when NS made their competitive debut the Teams trophy and the Manufacturers trophy. The Teams last year and the Manufacturers in 2006. Triple Eight are used to winning ATLEAST two per year.

VXR cannot and will not ever be beat. No matter what SEAT and NS do. It will have to take a manufacturer with a bigger budget than 888, better drivers than Giovanardi and a faster car than the Vectra. I just don't see a car faster than the Vectra and better than Giovanardi that actually physically exists.

tyreman2

3rd May 2008, 09:24

Your point? :confused:

NS may have as much if not more work to do than 888, but surely it is what both get in return from that work that matters. And as we have seen in the past 8 years 888 have gotten a little bit more in return from that work per year than NS have since they made their competitive debut.

SEAT have won since 2005 when NS made their competitive debut the Teams trophy and the Manufacturers trophy. The Teams last year and the Manufacturers in 2006. Triple Eight are used to winning ATLEAST two per year.

VXR cannot and will not ever be beat. No matter what SEAT and NS do. It will have to take a manufacturer with a bigger budget than 888, better drivers than Giovanardi and a faster car than the Vectra. I just don't see a car faster than the Vectra and better than Giovanardi that actually physically exists.

Sounds like we may be in for a change of name VXR FREAK!

Seriously though i have been trying to make the point in a couple of posts,that SEAT do have a car to beat VXR as soon as they sort out the understeer issue.If they can't sort that out then N+S deserve to get the sack.
I do agree with you that they need to find a "Gio"
1) Fix the understeer
2) Give the Job to GR Asia
3) Sign up Jackson and Jones....Job done! ........2009 champions SEAT UK

If only it was that easy! might be worth a try though.

SEATFreak

3rd May 2008, 15:07

Sounds like we may be in for a change of name VXR FREAK!

I swear on my mothers life and mine.....that I absolutely knew someone was gonna suggest that I change my name to VXRFreak just because I said what I said!! :laugh:

You think because I said all that, that it means I support VXR? I don't know if you are aware but I hate VXR. Every word grated on me I have you know. I said it because I can in no way deny that whatever SEAT do I know VXR will get the better of them. Sad but true.

tyreman2

3rd May 2008, 19:53

I swear on my mothers life and mine.....that I absolutely knew someone was gonna suggest that I change my name to VXRFreak just because I said what I said!! :laugh:

You think because I said all that, that it means I support VXR? I don't know if you are aware but I hate VXR. Every word grated on me I have you know. I said it because I can in no way deny that whatever SEAT do I know VXR will get the better of them. Sad but true.

IT WAS A JOKE !!!!

SEATFreak

4th May 2008, 08:50

I KNOW IT WAS A JOKE. WHY DID I PUT THAT SMILIE THERE IF I WASN'T JOKING. :p :

CroftPilgrim

12th May 2008, 16:48

To be honest using Jason as an example probably wasn't the best one as he doesn't read the forums these days.

Congratulations to Plato though, as he's now a dad!

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article1108787.ece

Seems he does! - http://btccpages.motorsportforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=126943
:)

AndySpeed

12th May 2008, 17:10

Yep I saw that. It's good to see so.

bt52b

16th May 2008, 10:40

YOU need big balls at Thruxton.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/racinjason/article1164860.ece

SEATFreak

16th May 2008, 11:07

Everyone at SEAT Sport UK is full of confidence at the moment and we’re on the ascendancy.

But this year we’re returning to Thruxton as the hunter, rather than the hunted.

We will see Jase mate, we will see.

One swallow does not make a summer Jase. One good meeting does not mean the team are in the accendancy and certainly are not the hunter (whatever that is a metaphor for).

It will be every bit as great as last time if it happens again, but I will be very surprised if the team repeats anything similar to Donny at Thruxton over VXR; surely the teams ultimate yardstick.

If the team are performing consistently doing what the team did at Donny then maybe those statements come true. But not after one meeting.

Alfa Fan

16th May 2008, 14:19

I dispair. Saying he is the hunter rather than the hunted means SEAT are now the one's chasing the front of the pack, not the other way round.

VX_Rules

16th May 2008, 15:31

Why does he always pre prepare his excuses! That bugs me. He's making out like their car is 100% new! I know it's different, but come on. If they didn't want to develope the car there was no need to change. And It's proven you can develope a car and win in it's First year. So stop whining!

SEATFreak

16th May 2008, 15:49

I dispair. Saying he is the hunter rather than the hunted means SEAT are now the one's chasing the front of the pack, not the other way round.

Has me, for the first time ever genuinely agreeing with you, set a rather gloomy precident?

Just when my week couldn't get any worse. :eek: :p :

It seems I ain't been so unwise to be sceptical and pesimistic after all. Not if being positive is saying unrealisticly positive things like that. Fact is Jase I bet it took....months...for 888/VXR to be confident in the way they are today. Have such a strong worldclass setup they know they are gonna deliver on their promises. Judging by the rate you seem to be painting we should achieve what VXR achieved over 8 years come October. I am sorry, factory support or no factory support that is impossible.

That is why I don't like being positive. You set yourself up for a fall bigging yourself. Atleast you cannot get let down if you expected to be let down.

Does anyone want custard or cream with that humble pie.