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katana
20th February 2008, 22:50
I can't understand the teams at Barcelona, hiding in their garages, waiting for better weather, why don't they get out there and work on the best setup for the conditions?

The GP's go ahead in whatever weather arrives, barring typhoons!

Surely it would make sense to be able to go as fast as possible in 'every' combination of weather, not wait for sun and clear skies, or a specific amount of rain.

Garry Walker
20th February 2008, 23:19
*No such thing as a perfect wet setup, pointless in trying to work towards that.
*Testing limit in KM, testing in wet is pointless as it gives very little data compared to what they really need. They want dry testing when they can get the data they need.
*Testing costs a lot of money, every lap costs a huge sum. Testing in wet, when there is little data to be gained, that would be stupid.

maxu05
21st February 2008, 04:57
What a bunch of nancy girls. Motogp tests in the wet, hail, rain or shine. And they are not protected by a cockpit. If the race is a wet race, the teams that got off their butts and tested in these conditions, are the teams that will do well. I think these drivers are paid too much to complain about a spot of rain.

Ranger
21st February 2008, 05:44
*Testing limit in KM, testing in wet is pointless as it gives very little data compared to what they really need. They want dry testing when they can get the data they need.

I think this one is the crux of the issue.

maxu05
21st February 2008, 08:00
I hope 90% of the races are wet :laugh:

wmcot
21st February 2008, 08:32
*No such thing as a perfect wet setup, pointless in trying to work towards that.
*Testing limit in KM, testing in wet is pointless as it gives very little data compared to what they really need. They want dry testing when they can get the data they need.
*Testing costs a lot of money, every lap costs a huge sum. Testing in wet, when there is little data to be gained, that would be stupid.

But it would seem to me that since these are new cars, a driver would want to be familiar with the handling in the wet. The middle of a thunderstorm during a grand prix seems to be a bad time to learn about how your car likes the wet!

ArrowsFA1
21st February 2008, 09:04
I can't understand the teams at Barcelona, hiding in their garages, waiting for better weather, why don't they get out there and work on the best setup for the conditions?
Good question :up:

Testing in wet, when there is little data to be gained, that would be stupid.
Given the concerns (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64725) raised about racing in the wet with no TC wouldn't it be wise to get some running in those conditions?

tinchote
21st February 2008, 12:13
Every wet race I've seen, the lap times were changing constantly as drivers were looking for the limit on each lap. It seems to me that in such conditions, track situation changes constantly and it is almost impossible to simulate. Because of the conditions not being steady, setup becomes a gamble, where the car maybe the fastest and then few laps (and raindrops) later it's been passed like a backmarker; or the other way round.

Besides, in a testing situation you usually have only a few cars in the track at a given time, while in a wet race you have 20+; this makes the track evolution very different.

In all, I tend to agree that it is pointless to test in the wet. It made some sense in the past when there was a tyre war and each manufacturer was striving for the best tyre. Now, with a spec tyre, it's the same game for everybody.

Tazio
21st February 2008, 14:45
Regardless of what you think about wet testing, teams were counting on testing new aero parts,
and tweaks on a new car for the impending first race of a new season.
They need to be up to speed, and at dry condition ground clearance to analyze them.
Most teams went out, got some laps in, and came in before they really F***ed something up on the car.
The saving grace is all teams are at the same disadvantage with the possible exception of Sauber.
But they got rain in Valencia as well. Not as much though!
This doesn't make the pilots "Nancy Girls"

21st February 2008, 14:52
If the teams had any plans to do wet-weather tests, they wouldn't have bothered going to Spain.

After all, if they wanted to do a full wet-weather test, they just have to pop down to Silverstone this time of year.

Tazio
21st February 2008, 15:55
Nancy Girl This!

petrolhead ben
21st February 2008, 17:04
Good question :up:

Given the concerns (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64725) raised about racing in the wet with no TC wouldn't it be wise to get some running in those conditions?

Good point. I was just thinking that. After all a lot of the current drivers haven't raced without TC before.
Might be quite useful to try it, although perhaps the teams don't want to waste valuble testing time in the wet. Would be interesting if it rains in Melbourne though wouldn't it?

Sleeper
21st February 2008, 22:30
Good point. I was just thinking that. After all a lot of the current drivers haven't raced without TC before.
Might be quite useful to try it, although perhaps the teams don't want to waste valuble testing time in the wet. Would be interesting if it rains in Melbourne though wouldn't it?
All of the current drivers have raced without TC, just not all in F1. Wet weather testing dosn't make much sense because, as already mentioned, the conditions in a race change too rapidly to simulate in a test.

jens
22nd February 2008, 17:49
Some are questioning that why aren't drivers trying to test and practice wet weather driving without TC...

The "problem" is that teams are testing the cars, not the drivers. Gaining data in dry conditions is more valuable than letting a driver trying to get familiar with a wet track. Drivers are expected to be top professionals in every conditions. Drivers need less 'practising' and have less room for 'improvement' than cars.

Tazio
22nd February 2008, 17:56
Thank you ^^

Tazio
22nd February 2008, 21:54
Good point. I was just thinking that. After all a lot of the current drivers haven't raced without TC before.
Might be quite useful to try it, although perhaps the teams don't want to waste valuble testing time in the wet. Would be interesting if it rains in Melbourne though wouldn't it?
You know now that you mention it.
This may have been a good opportunity to send Hamilton,
and Vettel out, and run some laps behind a safety car!

F1jet
23rd February 2008, 02:44
The Vettle/Hamilton/safteycar/rain joke are excellent reasons why the drivers need more experience in the wet. Other infamous moments: DC's wet Spa incident, and Schumi's coming up the backside also at Spa and so many others.

F1jet
23rd February 2008, 02:51
An engineer would say in a heartbeat that the data from changing conditions is worthless. An excellent point, but now, without TC or stability control or other driver aids and spec tires for all, the driver must decide what is possible.

Senna would lap them all.

ioan
23rd February 2008, 11:34
Senna would lap them all.

Who knows?! Maybe yes maybe not!

wmcot
25th February 2008, 08:35
An engineer would say in a heartbeat that the data from changing conditions is worthless. An excellent point, but now, without TC or stability control or other driver aids and spec tires for all, the driver must decide what is possible.

I agree completely! It seems that testing miles are only thought of in engineering terms, never in terms of driver experience.

Garry Walker
29th February 2008, 15:24
What a bunch of nancy girls. Motogp tests in the wet, hail, rain or shine. And they are not protected by a cockpit. If the race is a wet race, the teams that got off their butts and tested in these conditions, are the teams that will do well. I think these drivers are paid too much to complain about a spot of rain.

Stupid post. Very stupid.

The reason they are not testing is not because of fear, but because it would cost a lot of money, waste a lot of test KMs (which are limited) and not bring enough results.



concerns (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64725) raised about racing in the wet with no TC wouldn't it be wise to get some running in those conditions?

They are all professionals, they will cope. Testing is not for driver practise.
Kubica drove an F1 car for the first time in rain when he debuted at Hungary, he managed well.


I agree completely! It seems that testing miles are only thought of in engineering terms, never in terms of driver experience.

Because that is pretty much how it is.

As for the vettel/webbo incident. No matter how experienced you are, you still have brainfades.