Thread: WRC-Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012

Originally Posted by vkangas

All WRC rallies have their special charasteristics and there is no way Rally Finland should be an endurance event - there are better ones for that. Rally Finland has always been known as tight high speed event, "the gravel grand prix", not an endurance event. It's great that WRC series has a variety of different type of events.

I'd like to disagree. The rally is around 100km shorter than it used to be, and that's compared with 2003. I agree with what K. Sohlberg said on the radio that the rally needs to return to the old format of 3 days and have 50-70% of new stages because the current ones have been used for ten years. Different directions and different bits, but still the same roads.

Originally Posted by Mirek

I think that according to WRC regulations he could not use Yokohama tyres but only DMack or Michelin.

The tyres on the photo are without color logo which Yokohama ones have. Although the tread is very similar looking for both Michelin and Yokohama I would say it's Michelin what he was using...

Interesting. He said before the rally that they are going to use Yokohama's in this (finnish) interview: MSN Auto

But....MSN auto is about the most unreliable rally media in Finland

Breath-taking photos by ALM

- , 4 - - WRC - 2012 - - -

Originally Posted by Mirek

I think that according to WRC regulations he could not use Yokohama tyres but only DMack or Michelin.

The tyres on the photo are without color logo which Yokohama ones have. Although the tread is very similar looking for both Michelin and Yokohama I would say it's Michelin what he was using...

Jarkko did drove with yokohamas. As privateer the regulations are different.

Originally Posted by Co-FIN

Jarkko did drove with yokohamas. As privateer the regulations are different.

Thanks. I opened the rules now and I can see they were changed since the time when control tyres were introduced. Now they are mandatory only for priority drivers.

... so the Yokohamas can't be bad, can they?

Only one day of NORF for me this year, gallery now online: nikop.kuvat.fi

Novikov´s crash shot outside the car:



Only a matter of half a meter, said Evgeny.

Originally Posted by Mirek

I heard Citroën uses very different differential settings to Ford but I don't know anything detailed. I think Mikko also said something like that after first DS3 tests.

I think it applies also for asphalt. From slow hairpins Citroëns exit straight with almost no powersliding.

Also J-M.L said that Citroen had homologated new gravel dampers for this rally, so something different than just shimming has been done..

@ vkangas + AMSS
same i saw at Acropolis,Citroens more straight than Fords at all the stages i watch.Not at loose gravel,not overdriving,not wide where loose gravel-big stones-ditches appear.

About the ''better car'' plenty of people claim. There is no better car.Team has to adjust shocks-differentials,engine mapping at every rally.That Citroens have the proper setup at every rally,that isn t a ''better car''.It is a better setup of the car.
Better setup of the car is reponsibility of drivers and chief mechanics.If Latvala or Petter can t do it i conjuction with their mechanics,that is not making the ds3 better car,but them unable to setup the car.

They have some point I think. For first time this year I see Ford so slower than the Citroens, setup always plays significant role in the race, but Latvalla not to know how to do it in Finland... I doubt it.

I never really understood all this better car nonsense...

It is normal that someone will be better than someone else.. you rarely in any kind of competition have equality not only in motorsport...

It is in the hands of any driver to perform to a high standard in order to be picked up by the best and visa versa of course... if the team is crap it is not going to have many chances to sign a top driver.

I do not think that the difference between the cars right now is THAT big... Citroen have the edge of course but i think that results so far are because of the driving not the cars.

Yes how else do you explain Nikara in an old group N mixing with (and beating) a bunch of S2000s? The setup and car do matter, but there is a part of the setup that can be changed every half second in the middle of the stage... the driver's brain.

Loeb: "The upgrades made this weekend to the DS3 WRC, especially on the shock absorbers, enabled us to move up another notch in terms of performance"

Originally Posted by dimviii

@ vkangas + AMSS
same i saw at Acropolis,Citroens more straight than Fords at all the stages i watch.Not at loose gravel,not overdriving,not wide where loose gravel-big stones-ditches appear.

About the ''better car'' plenty of people claim. There is no better car.Team has to adjust shocks-differentials,engine mapping at every rally.That Citroens have the proper setup at every rally,that isn t a ''better car''.It is a better setup of the car.
Better setup of the car is reponsibility of drivers and chief mechanics.If Latvala or Petter can t do it i conjuction with their mechanics,that is not making the ds3 better car,but them unable to setup the car.

That`s partly true, the setup is a combination between driver feedback/feeling and engineers ideas. However if the engineers come with some new innovations that are a big improvement than it should be confirmed by the driver. Or do you think that Loeb or Latvala is planning new differential systems or such and than tells the engineer what to do??

Most likely they have come up with something new if they have used a yearly homologation for the dampers as you hardly use it if it`s not an improvement...

Anyhow Finland has never been a particulary good event for Latvala, the only win came when the clearly fastest driver on that event retired on the first day.
Also at all the years with Ford as a strong competitor in Finland it was Grönholm and Mikko who were basically responsible for the pre- event testing and basic setup!

Originally Posted by AMSS

Anyhow Finland has never been a particulary good event for Latvala, the only win came when the clearly fastest driver on that event retired on the first day.

So where was the world champion back then?

Originally Posted by AMSS

That`s partly true, the setup is a combination between driver feedback/feeling and engineers ideas. However if the engineers come with some new innovations that are a big improvement than it should be confirmed by the driver. Or do you think that Loeb or Latvala is planning new differential systems or such and than tells the engineer what to do??

i didnt said that Loeb or Latvala planning new differential systems.I said that you have write at your first line.

Originally Posted by AMSS

Most likely they have come up with something new if they have used a yearly homologation for the dampers as you hardly use it if it`s not an improvement...

Ford isn t allowed to make improvements?

By the way at ds3 they change the canister position,as is at Fords with reiger.They didnt invent a special rocket system.
Except that even with ''older'' suspension they were again faster.

Originally Posted by stefanvv

They have some point I think. For first time this year I see Ford so slower than the Citroens, setup always plays significant role in the race, but Latvalla not to know how to do it in Finland... I doubt it.

No for first time we saw battle till the end,so the difference was the proper.Proper difference we hadn t saw at previous rallies with the rally over at 1st day,or 2nd day due to Jaris stones,or Petters ''wrong setups''.

budget problems?