2014 Belgian GP Thread

[andyone]

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[journeyman racer]

I find it hard to understand why this incident in particular should prompt a change in the technical regulations. Punctures have been a feature of motor racing since day 1, and broken front wings have been a frequent occurrence in F1 for decades. You can't crash into each other in F1 cars, if you do it'll usually ruin your day and the other guy's. What's the problem with that? There's always touring car racing for those who prefer to see bumping and barging.

Are you satisfied that a minor incident had disproportionate consequences, particularly for Hamilton?

[The Black Knight]

He's certainly gained some balls this year and no doubt is trying his best to win his first world title. It's his best chance to date. Not sure he has gone away from Spa ecstatic though. He may have gone away satisfied that the pints difference has increased, but he's created a fallout within the team that is potentially the worse one yet. It's one thing not letting your team mate through, but putting them out of the race on the second lap is another matter. It must be similar to how Vettel felt when he left Malaysia last year. He got the result but not the support.


For us it's easy to move on though, what else can you do? Nothing can be changed and there's no point dwelling on it, although it's interesting to discuss. Plenty of points to play for and perhaps unreliability heading Rosberg's way? We don't know what's around the corner.

Well, to be honest, I feel the only way for Mercedes to ensure this won't happen again is to give cheating Nico a race off and bring a reserve driver in. That way Hamilton will win the next race. That will settle the points difference and send a message to both drivers of the consequences of hitting your teammate. Unfortunately, this is unlikely to happen, and Nico will actually get away with a slap on the wrist for this one.

[AndyL]

Are you satisfied that a minor incident had disproportionate consequences, particularly for Hamilton?

Who it had consequences for should have no bearing on whether the regulations need to be changed.
Similar minor incidents have big consequences for someone in almost every race. It's in the nature of racing cutting-edge open-wheel cars with wings. I don't understand why this incident suddenly means a rule change is needed.

[jens]

Well, so much talk here that I don't try to understand all of it, because it would create a headache.

So I try to make my point across short. I don't see deliberate action from Rosberg. Unlike Monaco, where I suspect it might have been the case.

But Belgium - I have seen many times drivers losing bits of front wing like that, while clipping the rear wheel of the driver ahead. The risk for the driver behind is just too big, you are very likely to damage your front wing, while there is no guarantee the driver in front gets a puncture. On most occasions they don't get a puncture.

Basically you need to be lucky to get a positive outcome for yourself to clip a driver like that. Hence it made no sense for Rosberg to try it deliberately, because by the "law of averages" he was likely to get away from the situation worse. He got fortunate there.

[steveaki13]

Well, so much talk here that I don't try to understand all of it, because it would create a headache.

So I try to make my point across short. I don't see deliberate action from Rosberg. Unlike Monaco, where I suspect it might have been the case.

But Belgium - I have seen many times drivers losing bits of front wing like that, while clipping the rear wheel of the driver ahead. The risk for the driver behind is just too big, you are very likely to damage your front wing, while there is no guarantee the driver in front gets a puncture. On most occasions they don't get a puncture.

Basically you need to be lucky to get a positive outcome for yourself to clip a driver like that. Hence it made no sense for Rosberg to try it deliberately, because by the "law of averages" he was likely to get away from the situation worse. He got fortunate there.

Sense Jens

[Doc Austin]

Well, to be honest, I feel the only way for Mercedes to ensure this won't happen again is to give cheating Nico a race off and bring a reserve driver in. That way Hamilton will win the next race.

That might work unless the reserve driver punts Hamilton, or Hamilton otherwise has a mechanical DNF. Then Ricciardo probably wins and now he truly is back in the hunt.

That will settle the points difference and send a message to both drivers of the consequences of hitting your teammate.

Maybe even better is that you make Nico the #2 driver and make him support Lewis until they are level on points, or at least until Nico is only ahead as much as he was going into the race. That way Hamilton advances and Nico doesn't give up any ground to Ricciardo.

You can't set Nico down because that makes him vulnerable to Ricciardo, points wise. You just want to assure Hamilton gets back the points he lost to Nico from Sunday. The only way I can see to do that is make Nico support Hamilton until the damage is undone.

Mercedes needs to wield the iron fist at this point and make both drivers know they won't tolerate any more of this. As it is, they will probably have to fire one of them at the season's end anyway. There is no way to repair the damage between the two. They don't trust each other and the team can't trust them not to take each other out. The drama has to be dragging the entire team down.

Once they are level on points, make them take turns until both championships are out of the competition's reach, and then let them race. Clearly you can't trust them to race each other cleanly, so you can't let them race until both championships are tucked away.

Unfortunately, this is unlikely to happen, and Nico will actually get away with a slap on the wrist for this one

Sadly you are probably right.

I would not be surprised if Hamilton has already cut a deal with McLaren.

[dj_bytedisaster]

Are you satisfied that a minor incident had disproportionate consequences, particularly for Hamilton?

Yes, because it had the same consequences for several drivers before him. He is hardly the first who collected a puncture from someone else's front wing. But as Jens said, most of the times the tyre stays okay and only the guy behind has a problem. He was simply unlucky.

What he did however cause himself is Nico's bad attitude. He has been smack-talking his team mate since before Monaco (all this 'Im hungrier, because he grew up as a rich kid' junk) Since very early in the season Lewis has tried to destabilize Nico by playing mind-games. That reminds me very much of Piquet and that man was a truly hateable individual.
Add to that, that Lewis is hardly a stranger to aggressive moves on his team mate. His 'defense' in Bahrain really pushed the boundaries of what is 'acceptable forcefulness'. The same goes for his running Nico off the road in Hungary. Up to now Nico had always backed out and Lewis had deluded himself into believing that Nico was a push-over. The thing that broke the camel's back was Lewis's refusal to let Nico pass when asked to do so. The writing was on the wall. This time Nico didn't back off. Lewis had relied on it and lost out. It was a hard move, but neither deliberate nor previously unheard of.

[steveaki13]

Anyone know what happened to Pastor Maldonado on Sunday?

I mean the commentators said Lotterer had stopped after 1 or 2 laps. It was only then when looking at the rolling positions that I saw he had retired even before Lotterer. All it says online is Exhaust

Strange this day and age to not see or hear anything about a car retiring. Back in the 90s you would not see evidence of half the cars in the race whatever.

It was like rolling back the years

[journeyman racer]

Who it had consequences for should have no bearing on whether the regulations need to be changed.

Jesus Christ! Derr! It just happened to be that Hamilton was the victim the other day. The fact is, it was a soft touch. It was not of Hamilton's doing, but he was unnecessarily inconvenienced by it. There's no reason why a leading car should be vulnerable in that situation. The only consequence that should've happened from that incident, was some minor damage to Rosberg's wing. Otherwise, play on.

Similar minor incidents have big consequences for someone in almost every race.

If you were asked to list them. You wouldn't be able to.

It's in the nature of racing cutting-edge open-wheel cars with wings. I don't understand why this incident suddenly means a rule change is needed.

It's alright being Mr Macho Man "This is open wheel racing/F1. That's how it is.". But with this attitude. You have to wait until some poor **** dies from that type of incident to then make a change. You'll then ask "They should've seen this coming and made changes before."

Yes, because it had the same consequences for several drivers before him. He is hardly the first who collected a puncture from someone else's front wing..

Yeah, well. Everyone here knows you were satisfied with the outcome. Even before posting it.