Massage to Indy brass...

[FIAT1]

...it's the CARS stupid. Build it and they will come!

[geosin1945]

This will rub them up the wrong way!!

[Chris R]

This will rub them up the wrong way!!

you beat me too it!!

Seriously, I do not think it is the cars, at least not in a way that the series itself can 'solve" (i.e. - even an exciting spec is still spec and you cannot MAKE people build great cars)....

Also, this car has most certainly delivered in terms of good racing. Sure it is not a looker (although I would argue that it is pretty slick in speedway trim) - but do you "marry" a performance "10" who runs off with every race she finds (often the case in F1 or even in the days of CART chassis competition) or a performance "7" that give you a great race almost every time???

I think the problem is much more comprehensive than the car and honestly, it has much less to do with anything that Indycar can actually control than anybody seems to be willing to believe.....

[FIAT1]

you beat me too it!!

Seriously, I do not think it is the cars, at least not in a way that the series itself can 'solve" (i.e. - even an exciting spec is still spec and you cannot MAKE people build great cars)....

Also, this car has most certainly delivered in terms of good racing. Sure it is not a looker (although I would argue that it is pretty slick in speedway trim) - but do you "marry" a performance "10" who runs off with every race she finds (often the case in F1 or even in the days of CART chassis competition) or a performance "7" that give you a great race almost every time???

I think the problem is much more comprehensive than the car and honestly, it has much less to do with anything that Indycar can actually control than anybody seems to be willing to believe.....

Same tracks, same players, same tradition, what is the problem. Ok is not a car. What else there. What they can sell me? Ride on ferris wheel. F1 and CART speak for themself in numbers of fans, media, tv etc. I guess 0.2 is happy with today spec racing. I don't see F1 suffering and I don't see 10 as you, I see perfection of motor racing on every level. Millions agree and pay to see it. I see 7 as good as how many yellows come out. I still believe Indycars problem is the spec product that is hard to sell. My opinion.

[Chris R]

Same tracks, same players, same tradition, what is the problem. Ok is not a car. What else there. What they can sell me? Ride on ferris wheel. F1 and CART speak for themself in numbers of fans, media, tv etc. I guess 0.2 is happy with today spec racing. I don't see F1 suffering and I don't see 10 as you, I see perfection of motor racing on every level. Millions agree and pay to see it. I see 7 as good as how many yellows come out. I still believe Indycars problem is the spec product that is hard to sell. My opinion.

The spec product is absolutely part of the issue - but I don't see an easy solution for it - I cannot imagine anyone lining up to build a unique team car for the series anymore.

One of the problems you cited was the yellows - that is not the car - that is a series worried about lawsuits and American's feelings about people getting hurt etc. For better or worse AOWR has been running scared since/because of the Krosnoff, Rodriguez, Moore, Zanardi, DaMatta, Renna, Dana and Wheldon accidents and it shows.... Formula 1 has been "lucky" that Senna was the last fatality and their procedures, rules and officiating show a certain amount of confidence due to that fact...

Also, really, the heyday of CART was not THAT diverse - for a while most everything was MArch, then a Lola, then a Reynard.... yes there was opportunity and that made things interesting for us fans - but I am not entirely convinced it pulled in more fans in and of itself.....

I think the heyday of CART had much more to do with a convergence of advertising opportunities that either no longer exist (tobacco) or have been surpassed in value by "new" media. CART was popular because it had a ton of corporate support that used the series as a marketing event either for lack of any other alternative (tobacco) or because it provided the best pre-internet advertising value....

Also, Formula 1 has been and continues to be similar in size in the market in question - the United States (I do not think TV ratings have improved that much for F1 in years if at all). The reason F1 is so big is that they have purposefully cultivated a much larger market and the core of that market (Europe) is and always has been much more interested in motorsports than the core American market. Indycar has always gone for the core US market and taken anything else it gets as a bonus....

I understand where you are coming from and I agree that an open spec would be way cool - but I just do not think it will make enough difference. With the exception of the very beginning of cars, the brief era of CART and the current NASCAR juggernaut (which is slowing quite a lot) auto racing has always been a well respected niche market in this country and even NASCAR is still barely grasping at "mainstream" relative to the stick and ball sports....

Indycar needs to do what it can with what it has and focus on being the best niche sport it can be so that the next time events converge to allow it to "go mainstream" it is healthy enough to grow to accommodate the situation.....

[FIAT1]

The spec product is absolutely part of the issue - but I don't see an easy solution for it - I cannot imagine anyone lining up to build a unique team car for the series anymore.

One of the problems you cited was the yellows - that is not the car - that is a series worried about lawsuits and American's feelings about people getting hurt etc. For better or worse AOWR has been running scared since/because of the Krosnoff, Rodriguez, Moore, Zanardi, DaMatta, Renna, Dana and Wheldon accidents and it shows.... Formula 1 has been "lucky" that Senna was the last fatality and their procedures, rules and officiating show a certain amount of confidence due to that fact...

Also, really, the heyday of CART was not THAT diverse - for a while most everything was MArch, then a Lola, then a Reynard.... yes there was opportunity and that made things interesting for us fans - but I am not entirely convinced it pulled in more fans in and of itself.....

I think the heyday of CART had much more to do with a convergence of advertising opportunities that either no longer exist (tobacco) or have been surpassed in value by "new" media. CART was popular because it had a ton of corporate support that used the series as a marketing event either for lack of any other alternative (tobacco) or because it provided the best pre-internet advertising value....

Also, Formula 1 has been and continues to be similar in size in the market in question - the United States (I do not think TV ratings have improved that much for F1 in years if at all). The reason F1 is so big is that they have purposefully cultivated a much larger market and the core of that market (Europe) is and always has been much more interested in motorsports than the core American market. Indycar has always gone for the core US market and taken anything else it gets as a bonus....

I understand where you are coming from and I agree that an open spec would be way cool - but I just do not think it will make enough difference. With the exception of the very beginning of cars, the brief era of CART and the current NASCAR juggernaut (which is slowing quite a lot) auto racing has always been a well respected niche market in this country and even NASCAR is still barely grasping at "mainstream" relative to the stick and ball sports....

Indycar needs to do what it can with what it has and focus on being the best niche sport it can be so that the next time events converge to allow it to "go mainstream" it is healthy enough to grow to accommodate the situation.....

I understand what u saying but if you own a steak house wouldn't be good idea to have a good steak first. Perhaps it won't matter much if things continue as they are.

[Nem14]

A front of the pack F1 car costs what - something like 5 or 6 times more than an Indy car?

Indy car desperately needs management stability (a benevolent dictator), and a freaking plan. (No. Not tony george)

[zako85]

Formula 1 is immensely popular. But I don't think it's just the cars. For example, there is one dimension to Formula 1 that IndyCar completely lacks. And that is TEAM COMPETION. Formula 1 has a constructor's championship. Of course, some teams are poor and others are rich. One way to offset this and have a sport where even weak team can sometimes score points and even podiums is to have TWO CARS PER TEAM. point. Cars of the same team use the same LIVERIES, which make it clear that cars belong to the same team. A lot of people are used to root for one team, regardless of who is driving it. The Tifosi support Ferrari. The British tend to root for McLaren and Williams, etc. IndyCar has none of this.

However, cars do add a lot of excitement and unpredictability to F1. Some teams start a season with a good car, score podiums, then let their development slide by the end of year, and have a hard time fighting for points finishes. Sometimes the reverse happens when a team (specially rich team) starts season slow and improves the car considerably during the season. However, it's not clear how Indycar can afford this. A good compromise would be to allow the idea of customer chassis or aero kits bolted on the current Dalara chassis.

[Starter]

Formula 1 is immensely popular. But I don't think it's just the cars. For example, there is one dimension to Formula 1 that IndyCar completely lacks. And that is TEAM COMPETION. Formula 1 has a constructor's championship. Of course, some teams are poor and others are rich. One way to offset this and have a sport where even weak team can sometimes score points and even podiums is to have TWO CARS PER TEAM. point. Cars of the same team use the same LIVERIES, which make it clear that cars belong to the same team. A lot of people are used to root for one team, regardless of who is driving it. The Tifosi support Ferrari. The British tend to root for McLaren and Williams, etc. IndyCar has none of this.

Some good points. It would be difficult though for most teams to field identical liveried cars since only two teams have the same sponsor for both cars.

[00steven]

The casual fan doesn't give a rats ass about the cars. They care about what's trending, shove it there face and they will watch.