What Happens Next?

[garyshell]

What happens next? nothing...

IRL still the same, maybe with more cars and more crashs...

Do you really wait something new from TG ???

Yes, and if you don't why are you here? I am not suggesting you have to love "...king George", god knows I despise the little weasel. I am just saying if your mind is made up and your expectations are that low, why do you come here to this forum. You might find more kindred spirits drowning in their sorrows over on the CCF forums. Most of us here are resigned to the fact that OWRS is gone, and are ready to see what happens next.

Gary

[Hoop-98]

So was your participation here about the racing or about the "argument"? Now that the "argument" has been more or less settled, you no longer want to participate? What about the racing? Don't loose sight of that! Don't go yet, stick around a while until the first few races are under our belts. Enjoy some bench racing again. You just might rekindle what it was that brought you here in the first place. Ya never know.

Gary

CW has become the Forum equivalent of write only memory (WOM).....or hanging chads, disenfranchosed (SIC on purpose)

rh

[rpralon]

Yes, and if you don't why are you here? I am not suggesting you have to love "...king George", god knows I despise the little weasel. I am just saying if your mind is made up and your expectations are that low, why do you come here to this forum. You might find more kindred spirits drowning in their sorrows over on the CCF forums. Most of us here are resigned to the fact that OWRS is gone, and are ready to see what happens next.

Gary

OK... but I think real IRL fans just want more IRL races like the races they are used to watching. They don't want Panoz DP01, or Road America, they don't know who is R. Dorboos or Bernoldi or Rocketsports. They like Danica, they like Dalaras and they like crashes.

Maybe TG thinks the same and perhaps he isn't worried to catch CC fans (from CCF or not) or revive CART's great days, etc... Probably he only wants to restore the importance of Indy's 500 in the American sport scenario. So waiting some kind of revolution in AOW because the dead of CC and the incorporation of its teams and some of its races in IRL can be nothing more than a waste of time if you don't like IRL as IRL are...

[heelntoe]

OK... but I think real IRL fans just want more IRL races like the races they are used to watching. They don't want Panoz DP01, or Road America, they don't know who is R. Dorboos or Bernoldi or Rocketsports. They like Danica, they like Dalaras and they like crashes.

Maybe TG thinks the same and perhaps he isn't worried to catch CC fans (from CCF or not) or revive CART's great days, etc... Probably he only wants to restore the importance of Indy's 500 in the American sport scenario. So waiting some kind of revolution in AOW because the dead of CC and the incorporation of its teams and some of its races in IRL can be nothing more than a waste of time if you don't like IRL as IRL are...

I disagree on all fronts as I think everyone truly knows that the sport needs help and cannot remain the same no matter which side of the fence you sit on. Not knowing who Doornbos or Bernoldi should not be a bad thing, but knowing Rocketsports IS definitely a bad thing We all have to give this thing time and even TG said in the first days that he needed to embrace change...we need to encourage that change for a win win for all of us...just my opinion, of course.

[indycool]

No, I don't think TG is counting on a single person from F-Troop or having a CW 'tude to embrace the series and I imagine he fully expects CW to carry on with its hate program until the end of time. He has much more important things to do than try to appease 300 or so of them in the big picture.

Whether his staff had anything to do with it or not, and I don't have a clue one way or the other, Castroneves appeared on a dance show 10 straight weeks in front of 20 million viewers per week. Whoever did that, and I expect it took several staff people from various entities to, wonderful.

200 million viewers in the U.S. of a two-time Indianapolis 500 winner in a TV competition vs. 300 crappies? If I was him, I sure wouldn't worry about 'em. They're loud, but they're few. If they'd have said the same things about me through the years that they've said about TG, I sure wouldn't care about 'em in any way.

As for drivers, a few new ones show up each year. Max Papis just got a ride for Indy with Jason Prietley's team and Max is popular wherever he goes. The new ones like Doornbos, Rahal, Wilson, Power, etc., just hafta make their own way. Bernoldi is apparently out because he doesn't want to run ovals and Gentilozzi said he couldn't make it work for Rocketsports.

[garyshell]

OK... but I think real IRL fans just want more IRL races like the races they are used to watching. They don't want Panoz DP01, or Road America, they don't know who is R. Dorboos or Bernoldi or Rocketsports. They like Danica, they like Dalaras and they like crashes.

Maybe TG thinks the same and perhaps he isn't worried to catch CC fans (from CCF or not) or revive CART's great days, etc... Probably he only wants to restore the importance of Indy's 500 in the American sport scenario. So waiting some kind of revolution in AOW because the dead of CC and the incorporation of its teams and some of its races in IRL can be nothing more than a waste of time if you don't like IRL as IRL are...

"Real IRL fan" ah the magic prejudicial words. What do you know of the real IRL fan, all you know is what you have been spoonfed by the likes of the CCF forum. You wouldn't know a real IRL fan if it came up and bit your... And for that matter neither would I. The point is you have this distorted stereotype that may or, more likely, may not be accurate.

So as I asked before, if "IRL can be nothing more than a waste of time if you don't like IRL as IRL are..." is true, why are you here? What purpose could it possibly serve for you or a "true IRL fan" or those of us who are new to the series and are wating to see how this shakes out.

Gary

[weeflyonthewall]

The key to AOWR landing the respect it deserves is putting less emphasis on Indy and more emphasis on the entire racing season. Fast-tracking a modified Panoz DP01 for inclusion at Indy would certainly help. Those Dallara's are more than ugly, they are dangerous. Graham Rahal made that very clear when he chose his career path into open wheel.

[Chaparral66]

So, it seems that the vast majority of ChampCar's events were indeed losing money in a significant way. It is sad that most will not happen this year or perhaps ever again but it does illustrate what a brazen bluff The Amigos were running during these past four years.

In hindsight it looks to me like Paulie G-String did what he does best back in 2003. He took advantage of the anti-TG hatred he found in dark places on the web and in some corners of the ChampCar paddock. He then tapped into a bunch of delusional rich hobby boys ready and willing to be taken for an egoporn thrill ride. Now that their massive tax right offs no longer make sense, so goes the Champ Car World Series. Their combined arrogance, greed and spite were never going to end up creating anything other than the mess we have today. I have pointed this out to many people over the years. The "Amigos-Uber-Alles" types I spoke with had been completely seduced by the real Dark Side and they spewed back all the irrational things our dear departed Sanguin did before he went missing. Some called me nasty names and others did very damaging things to me personally because I chose not to believe or support all the all lies and spin.

Isn't it interesting how it all turned out? It was never about the racing (and the racing was good sometimes).

Do I feel vindicated? Hell yes!

From my perspective, the OWRS era was all about the ugly side of the human spirit. It is amusing how everyone from KK to Mark C. to certain posters here on these boards have changed their tunes now that reality has caught up with them. So to them, I offer some some advice that I myself will now heed: GET A LIFE!

So, this is probably my last post. Thanks to everyone I met here for caring so much about our beautiful sport. May the years ahead bring the healing and the success we all dream of. Shalom -- Chaim

Vindicated? About what? We didn't really see The Amigos for who they were until relatively recently. We already knew about TG. We supported The Amigos because they were the ones who came to the rescue of our preferred style of racing. That would have happened whether it was The Amigos or Bill Gates (who could have done it out of petty cash), it was almost incidental who rescued CC.

But even as that was going on, most of us in the CC side were indeed, focused on the racing. We cared about Long Beach, Laguna Seca, Road America, Michigan, Fontana, Milwaukee, Cleveland and the like. We cared about Ford Cosworth Turbo engines and competition from Honda and Toyota. We cared about a strong and relaible TV package that allowed us to see races live and allowed our friends in Canada, Mexico, Europe, and Australia. The politics by its very nature and media reaction had become just as important as the racing, because it wouldn't stop, until now.

Reality having caught up to us? It is what it is. You can either accept it, or be in denial, and speaking for myself, I choose to accept the one series as it now stands. Not much choice. As I told IC, I'm willing to keep and open mind and continue watch, in the hopes that the sport can finally leave this dark episode behind and grow beyond the politics. I also told IC that the new series will have to work very hard to justify it's existence, but I'm willing to give it a chance. I also don't want leave any hard feelings (which I don't have to begin with) that might get in the way of all of us enjoying it and continuing on the forum discussing the events. That's why I also hope this isn't your last post. But this is no time to get cocky about what's happened, we have a duty as fans (since it is clear to me that the brass in both series look at chat rooms) to keep our voices heard with all the passion we can muster. This merger happened in part because we never lowered our voices; we all shouted "ENOUGH!!" That's a good thing. But don't start thinking there was a clear winner in this war, meaning CCWS or the IRL. What we have here is a negotiated settlement, in other words, a draw. The only winner here was NASCAR, and it will stay that way until open wheel racing can rebuild itself.

[indycool]

Gary, defining a "real IRL fan" is probably the various fan groups who meet at the Brickyard Crossing Flag Room each week to watch old racing movies, the guys that hang out at shops on Gasoline Alley and Charlie Brown's on Main Street in Speedway and the various fans who have warmed up to it at Nashville, Texas, Kansas, Chicagoland, Richmond, etc.

Very few of those are Internet "combatants," so to speak. The IRL forum at one board I visit has very few political issues.

I'd hate to think that F-Troop sets the standard for "real CART/CC fans." And I don't think that. I think that those who attended CART/CC races at permanent courses were race fans and probably, like those at IRL sites, didn't give a poop about any split 12 years ago.

weefly, you can add an IMO to your post. The DP-01 doesn't even have an oval kit, let alone being tested on an oval somewhere. And if IT was going to make that much of a difference, as CC proclaimed, why didn't it in '07?

[Chaparral66]

Gary, defining a "real IRL fan" is probably the various fan groups who meet at the Brickyard Crossing Flag Room each week to watch old racing movies, the guys that hang out at shops on Gasoline Alley and Charlie Brown's on Main Street in Speedway and the various fans who have warmed up to it at Nashville, Texas, Kansas, Chicagoland, Richmond, etc.

Very few of those are Internet "combatants," so to speak. The IRL forum at one board I visit has very few political issues.

I'd hate to think that F-Troop sets the standard for "real CART/CC fans." And I don't think that. I think that those who attended CART/CC races at permanent courses were race fans and probably, like those at IRL sites, didn't give a poop about any split 12 years ago.

weefly, you can add an IMO to your post. The DP-01 doesn't even have an oval kit, let alone being tested on an oval somewhere. And if IT was going to make that much of a difference, as CC proclaimed, why didn't it in '07?

IC, do you mean the DP-01 doesn't have an oval kit now, or never did? My impression was that Panoz had designed the car to race on ovals or be able to use an oval kit, should CC return to them in the future. They just hadn't tested them yet since there wasn't a need to, and I guess the point is moot, for now. But my thinking was that Champ Car would be ready for that eventuality, if it came to pass.