The Official Sebastian Vettel Fan Support Group Thread

[Alfa Fan]

Schumacher in 05 (USGP doesn't count)

Of course it counts. He won that race for the very reason he was unable to win any of the others..

[Tazio]

Of course it counts. He won that race for the very reason he was unable to win any of the others..

Amen brother.

[N. Jones]

yeah but a few world champions dont win a race a year after they have been champions in a row.. huh

Some world champions only won one race in their championship year.

[zako85]

4 trophies. But it was the same story. Not good enough to win a Domestic Rally comp.

2010 was one of the most competitive years of all time. 2012 was pretty good too, with the title battle going into the last race of season.

[zako85]

yeah but a few world champions dont win a race a year after they have been champions in a row.. huh

Vettel sets a new record. Hurray!

[jens]

Yeah, Vettel is having an average year and is worse than I thought. He is a 4-trick pony though. Or even 6-trick, because 2008 was already very good too. And even during that period rules changed somewhat. Completely new rules in 2009, in 2011 we got the undurable Pirelli tyres, in 2012 we got EBD ban.

I agree he has probably burnt out. Like Häkkinen in 2001. Even Seb's usual late-season spurt is non-existent though at least he has started qualifying very well again.

[rjbetty]

Yep, of course Seb is one of the top drivers, I think almost all of us acknowledge that.

But I think the reason some of us are a little unhappy with dj is that he spent four years crowing of how Vettel is the greatest, not at all taking into regard any of Webber's issues holding him back, then when now the shoe is on the other foot, being as ungracious a loser as he was a winner, frankly.

I don't mind really but I can see why others might be a little put out.

It may just be that Sebby is one of the best but not the best. Nothin to be ashamed of. I rate him equal to Rosberg but a tiny bit above, since I'm not sure Nico would have won 4 in a row, plus Monza 2008 etc.

I think Hamilton is faster/more talented, but Vettel has shown he's excellent at "managing" what he is, maybe better than Alonso in some ways.

He's allowed a bad year, but if this continues next year, we have to think about cutting the excuses.

[steveaki13]

Hear what your saying rj, but in my opinion I cannot rate a 4 time world champion level with someone yet to win a single championship.

I believe once you have won one, you can be compared in a way because you can do it and win a title.

Vettel on the other hand is not 4 times better than Hamilton and is not twice as good as Fred.

[rjbetty]

Hear what your saying rj, but in my opinion I cannot rate a 4 time world champion level with someone yet to win a single championship.

That's cool

But what I also meant to say was that I had in mind something Niki Lauda said in 2010. He stated that he felt Nico Rosberg was actually doing pretty much as good a job as Vettel, which seemed a surprise at the time. The same year, and in 2011, Ross Brawn observed that Nico was actually VERY good in qualifying, as Michael was struggling against him. It's interesting to recall this in light of this season.

I also don't know how Vettel would handle Hamilton as a team-mate if he was in the Mercedes. Maybe he'd be pressured into making more mistakes and thus looking a little weaker, since he had it a little easier with an aging (in F1 terms) Webber.

I have been thinking lately about Vettel's recent years. What I think may not have been noticed so much, but I feel is actually every bit as crucial as having (mostly) the best car, is the tender loving care and support he received. I feel a lot of people rubbish or minimise this factor, but if you look at the best drivers over time, this seems to be VERY important in helping a driver reach another level in themselves, when they know they are favoured, and something Vettel benefitted from much more than most drivers.

[jens]

The might has fallen. Let's embrace the new era with new contenders.

The psychological, also physical/endurance/exhaustion side of a sportsman is certainly interesting as well. For years you are consistently at the top, able to get a good run and challenge. Then a new year starts with lots of car problems, the car being not so good, team-mate being too good. You fight an uphill battle, such uphill you have never faced in your career and you break, run out of steam you can't take it any more. The recent races have been really unimpressive by Vettel. At least earlier in the season he could genuinely compete with Ricciardo, often let down by reliability, but now he is just not fast.

By the way, Hülkenberg is also going through slump. The same Hulk, who had a stunning second half of 2013 in the Sauber. I still remember him qualifying 3rd at Monza in the Sauber. Now he was nowhere in Force India. Well, just as another example of a slump and ups-and-downs. Interestingly I see some similarities between Vettel and Hulk. People often say that Vettel is only good in a good car, but there is some deeper reasoning IMO. Vettel was good in 2008 midfield STR. And in many periods Hulk has been good in midfield cars though he never had top cars. It seems there are certain car characteristics they struggle with. Also both Vettel and Hulk (2012, 2013) have often been particularly impressive in the second half of seasons, but not the case in 2014... The "twin-stuff" reminds me of Button and Heidfeld - I always maintainted those two drivers were somewhat similar...

Maybe it will be good for Vettel. To start 2015 as an underdog without many expectations - an average driver in a (most probably) pretty good(ish) car. 2014 is a lost cause. Bye for 2014. Eyes for 2015 to relax and recharge the batteries. Oh, and during 2014 we haven't seen the finger for a single time. Though a couple of quali sessions have been close to P1...