MotoGP - Misano

[ozrevhead]

Come back 500cc 2 strokes, sort the men from boys!

yep Id love it too because when Casey wins then as well everyone will run out of excuses and will be forced to admit how good he is!!!

[AndyRAC]

yep Id love it too because when Casey wins then as well everyone will run out of excuses and will be forced to admit how good he is!!!

Although it said partly tongue in cheek, there was an article in a magazine and Stoner would like to ride one. Would like to see him on one, I've no doubt he'd be successful. Too much is made of the tyres for his dominance. The kid is riding fantastically, give him the credit he deserves, plus his wife's a stunner!

[The Phantom]

Came across a post-Misano Rossi interview, where he commented that it's a pity that it's no longer the case that the rider is the most significant aspect of the performance (words to that effect). I'm disappointed to see Rossi making such petulant comments, as I have more respect for him and his achievements than anyone else out there - to date, only Pedrosa had been blaming everything but his own performance. Everyone else out there can see what's going on, and is man enough to say so. Yes, technology is here. But Rossi has used emerging technology to his benefit over the years, arguably more so than any other current rider! You can't have it both ways (although rumour has it that he does, but this isn't that sort of forum ; )

Perhaps if Rossi could get closer to Stoner he'd realise that Stoner is simply riding the rings out of the bike... he's in select company, here's my list of the riders who do the same and get the results. In no particular order:

Hopkins (has not had the results he's deserved, that's changing)
Mladin
Bayliss
Sofuoglu
Vermeulen (also now starting to shine - if he can reach his WSB form then Stoner will have a fight on his hands for wins)

I can't speak for BSB as I'm not following it this year, but past experience tells me there's that many again in BSB alone. All of these guys do the business from start to finish - no late charges, no breaking away and then backing off. No overt mind games on or off the track. No whinging when it doesn't go their way (well Hopper has a few times, but in his defence he's stuck it out while the bike went through its adolesence, and is a major contributor to its current form).

As always, we'll just let the riding do the talking... Stoner is the first rider to win three in a row on a non-Japanese bike since Ago, and is likely to take 13 wins this year, surpassing Doohan (12) and Rossi (11). He has more points at this time than Hayden had overall last year, with 5 rounds to go. He has led something like 2/3rds of all laps so far in 2007. He broke the pole-to-win curse.

But yeah, if he wasn't on a Ducati (with a whole 5 years* worth of GP experience in it), he'd be getting hosed every round. It's not like he's put his whole life into becoming world champion, or anything...



(images from http://www.caseystoner.com.au/bio.php)

* Funny how no-one is commenting on the superlative efforts of Ducati in building the best 4-stroke GP bike ever? Might start a topic on that one.

[The Phantom]

BTW I'm not implying that people here are bagging Stoner, you guys know which way is up. I guess I'm just venting at what I'm reading elsewhere. I understand the 'boring' comments, but of course you understand that it's not boring at all to Australians

He looks impressive no matter what he's riding:

[ChrisS]

In my mind its something like this:

60% rider 40% bike, at worst its 50-50, the bike importance has increased for rider 80% bike 20% as Burgess described it back in the 500s but still the rider is more important. In comparison I rate F1 as 80% car 20% driver

[ChrisS]

An interesting article on the subject (this is just a part of it that someone typed for another forum)

"MotoGP.........is the fun over"?

MotoGP has changed they call it "progress". There has always been and will always BE.....progress. In the 1980's 500cc GP bikes were made more manageable by the perfection of reed valves technology. In the 90's the bikes were futher tamed by the introduction of the big-bang firing order. In 1998 they were emasculated by the switch to "greener" fuel which made them "like big 250's" according to 500cc master Doohan. Then in 2002 they finally had their bollocks chopped off when MotoGP went to 990cc 4 strokes. As former 500cc winner Christian Sarron said, "The four strokes are nice bikes......for girls".

But is engine management-traction control, wheelie control, launch control, engine-braking control, REALLY sucking the glory out of MotoGP, just like it did with F1 cars? YES, if you ask the riders. EVEN 800's genius Casey Stoner thinks so. "These things should be 1500's not 800's," Stoner says. "In fact I'd rather be on a 500cc two-stroke, they weren't stacked out with computer control systems. THESE 800s.....everyone can ride them."

Valentino Rossi: "I prefer the 990s becuase the latest control systems make it harder for the rider to make the difference." In other words, the most talented riders want nastier bikes so they can use their rare skills to beat their lesser rivals.

Colin Edwards agrees that electronics have taken some of the talent out of MotoGP. "You go into a turn, you take your line, you open the gas and the bike somewhat takes care of itself," Edwards says, which doesn't sound very difficult at all. "In the old days you used to come out of a turn, get on the gas and you'd go "Man, I could've got on it five meters earlier....next lap you're on it five meters ealier and then you're flying to the moon, so that's where traction control really helps".

Riders fully rely on the technology to keep them out of trouble. Earlier this season, eavesdropped on a MotoGP ace debriefing his engineers after practice. The rider had been flicked over the highside when he got too eager with the throttle....AND he was angry. "I should never have crashed" he told his crew chief. "The traction control should have taken care of it."

[Dr. Gellar]

BTW another problem MotoGP is having for a while now but I think was especially obvious at Misano is the size of the Grid, just 19 riders

2 riders crashed from the start, Hayden and Kurtis were left far behind the rest, 2 riders retired later in the race, the Dunolp tyres of tech3 only lasted half the distance, that basically meant that Edwards, Nakano and the Hoff got a top 10 finish (hoff 11th) just by keeping it upright and bringing it home

I totally agree with ChrisS. Having only 19 bikes on the grid is way too few. Watching the start of the race at Misano, I was looking at the grid thinking, "That's it?? The grid looks half-empty." There has been all this talk about tires and Stoner's dominance ruining the show, but the problem of having a very thin grid to begin with seems to have been quietly swept under the rug, if only for the time being. There need to be more players in the big show.

[osg]

Came across a post-Misano Rossi interview, where he commented that it's a pity that it's no longer the case that the rider is the most significant aspect of the performance (words to that effect). I'm disappointed to see Rossi making such petulant comments, as I have more respect for him and his achievements than anyone else out there - to date, only Pedrosa had been blaming everything but his own performance. Everyone else out there can see what's going on, and is man enough to say so. Yes, technology is here. But Rossi has used emerging technology to his benefit over the years, arguably more so than any other current rider! You can't have it both ways (although rumour has it that he does, but this isn't that sort of forum ; )

Perhaps if Rossi could get closer to Stoner he'd realise that Stoner is simply riding the rings out of the bike... he's in select company, here's my list of the riders who do the same and get the results. In no particular order:

Hopkins (has not had the results he's deserved, that's changing)
Mladin
Bayliss
Sofuoglu
Vermeulen (also now starting to shine - if he can reach his WSB form then Stoner will have a fight on his hands for wins)

I can't speak for BSB as I'm not following it this year, but past experience tells me there's that many again in BSB alone. All of these guys do the business from start to finish - no late charges, no breaking away and then backing off. No overt mind games on or off the track. No whinging when it doesn't go their way (well Hopper has a few times, but in his defence he's stuck it out while the bike went through its adolesence, and is a major contributor to its current form).

As always, we'll just let the riding do the talking... Stoner is the first rider to win three in a row on a non-Japanese bike since Ago, and is likely to take 13 wins this year, surpassing Doohan (12) and Rossi (11). He has more points at this time than Hayden had overall last year, with 5 rounds to go. He has led something like 2/3rds of all laps so far in 2007. He broke the pole-to-win curse.

But yeah, if he wasn't on a Ducati (with a whole 5 years* worth of GP experience in it), he'd be getting hosed every round. It's not like he's put his whole life into becoming world champion, or anything...



(images from http://www.caseystoner.com.au/bio.php)

* Funny how no-one is commenting on the superlative efforts of Ducati in building the best 4-stroke GP bike ever? Might start a topic on that one.

hitting the nail firmly on the head again Phantom...........