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Thread: [WRC] News & Rumours 2018
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23rd May 2018, 17:07 #1551
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Tänaks onboard from that stage https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0B3LSBrBpw&t=
but you cant really see if he hits them or not, maybe he hits the last oneLast edited by EstWRC; 23rd May 2018 at 17:11.
#8 Ott Tänak - Martin Järveoja #8
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23rd May 2018, 17:23 #1552
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It's not about "bothering" or whether it changes things or not. Rules must be 1) clear, 2) same for all stages and 3) same for all drivers. And this, obviously, has not been the case here. I would agree with mr. Wilson that they have a strong case if they want to take it further.
ku ois neljä pyörää ku vetäis ni ois vähän eri sekunnit kyllä pätkillä, sen mä takaan
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23rd May 2018, 17:37 #1553
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I'm not saying the stewards shouldn't bother, I'm saying they didn't bother and I explained probably why.
Also 1) I agree, 2) I don't agree: rules are already different for the PS, since it gives extra points. It seems normal to me that small time gain in the PS requires a bigger punishment, 3) I agree, of course.
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23rd May 2018, 17:51 #1554
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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle WA, USA
Vive le Prole-le-ralliat
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23rd May 2018, 18:04 #1555
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Funny how they call him "French talking Belgian" while little more than 10 years ago he almost didn't speak French at all. He quickly learnt French very well, which was important for his career as a rally-driver. Anyway, the language he speaks and the region he comes from is unimportant. Among rally enthusiasts he's just as popular in all parts/communities of Belgium.
- Likes: AnttiL (23rd May 2018),cali (24th May 2018),EightGear (23rd May 2018),Hartusvuori (23rd May 2018),pantealex (24th May 2018)
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23rd May 2018, 19:11 #1556
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I´d like to add, that as an international rallyfan, to me it doesn´t matter from where you come, as long as it is a competent, naturally talented, humble and nice guy, the driver will be popular anyway.
Having said that, I mean it can be said about all the guys in the circus."Reis vas pät pat kaar vas kut"
Tommi Mäkinen, back in the years...
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23rd May 2018, 20:02 #1557
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Well...
talking about details in the appeal:
- M-Sport uses stage time differences between SS21 and SS22 to argue that Ogier did not improve more than other drivers. They specifically point out that Meeke (who got worse time) should not be counted. At the same time they don't mention that Mikkelsen (the only driver with more improvement than Ogier) had a spin in first run. if you leave him out Ogier actually did improve most of all . This is selective picking of circumstantial evidence.
- Ogier improves his time by some 0.6s after the chicane, part of which obviously could be due to slightly different (more direct) line out of it and into the next corner (last corner of stage). They also show how he has some 10 km/h faster speed in this section trough finish. They play this down by saying it's because he had 3 x Hard tires vs 2x Hard 2x Soft in first run which should help in this tarmac section. Clearly there are other people with more data on this, but taking Portugal as example Neuville and Sordo on soft worn gravel tires were much faster on tarmac than others on hards, so from my view this is not a clear argument to use.
- The parts about different placement and others hitting it a bit are true but don't change the fact that Ogier was the only one hitting the first part.
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Clearly it's not 100% clear case for giving the penalty, but neither is there one for removing it. He did hit it, and did hit it most out of all competitors.
But then there is the circumstances and "sending a message" part
a) Ogier and M-Sport opened a can of worms with the Sweden powerstage stunt. (as is clear to everyone except Eddie, they exploited the rules. More precisely: exploited that fact that the penalty for deliberately breaking the rules did not hurt given PS points). This exploit (which FIA should have thought about immediatelly when they started giving PS points) might also decide the title in the end.
=> If Ogier/M-Sport want to exploit the rules to the max there certainly is a payback element involved here.
b) They (Ogier + M-Sport) asked after SS21 and Neuville's issue. so clearly they had to be punished when they hit most of the chicane out of all competitors on second run.
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As to the chicane issues I agree with David Evans that there needs to be consistency and clearly defined penalties (i.e. 5s for touching/moving a chicane written in rulebook).Last edited by mknight; 23rd May 2018 at 20:04.
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23rd May 2018, 20:11 #1558
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Colin Clark repeating my view re the use of lightweight chicanes...
My view, @SebOgier’s been shafted! If organisers don’t want objects that they place on the route to be moved, make them from concrete. Or do what the Finns did, and put tractors as chicanes. I also think Lappi and Sordo were shafted in Portugal. Bad precedent. https://t.co/2bffPDoPve
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23rd May 2018, 20:16 #1559
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Tractor chicanes were unanimously hated by competitors and not used again.
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23rd May 2018, 20:47 #1560
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https://twitter.com/richmillener/sta...29794801184768
look at Neuvilles reply, i dont get what is he tryin to say?#8 Ott Tänak - Martin Järveoja #8
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Here you go.
[WRC] Vodafone Rally de Portugal...