International Rally Driver of the Year - 2017

[ESTR]

Best way to settle this is to see them maybe at ROC some day head to head. Or maybe if Loeb comes back into WRC (and if he will be still competitive for the top times).

[Mirek]

You mean Ogier comes into a new team who's car is not builded for him. And if it is not enough gamble, M-Sport is a half private team with less financial resources.
Ogier is champion with two teams. We saw Makkinen struggle after the switch from Mitsubishi to Subaru. Loeb hasn't make a switch. He stays with the French PSA family.

Number facts about how fast Loeb was are right. The switch to this team make him Champion in the first year at M-sport makes Ogier 'great'. For me he is.

Nobody switches from winning team for fun. Ogier switched because he had to not because he wanted to. He managed to take the title regardless. Hats off to him but that doesn't downplay Loeb's titles at all.

Best way to settle this is to see them maybe at ROC some day head to head. Or maybe if Loeb comes back into WRC (and if he will be still competitive for the top times).

That's nonsense. First some stupid show event means nothing and second they are different generations. Loeb retired already.

The only way to compare drivers (if somebody really feels the need to do so) is by their achievements. Loeb is and most likely will stay unmached for a long time coming. That's simply a fact.

[tommeke_B]

Every era has it's own characteristics, and every new generation has learned things from the previous ones. I don't think it makes sense to put the statistics from Ogier against those from Loeb. Many people dislike Loeb as some manufacturers stopped rally-activities during (or due to) his dominance... I think it's fair to say Loeb has changed the sport and opened many eyes. I think people have become much more analytical during those years, even in national events.

But back on topic, best driver of 2017... Hard to argue against Ogier, he was the smartest and most consistent. Neuville was quickest, but a bit too unreliable, both driver and car. You can call it bad luck when a wheel breaks off, but not when it happens on 4 events... Great progress has been seen from Evans and Tänak. Latvala had some bad luck with technical issues, but did a good season as well. Mikkelsen did few events but when he competed, he did a great job. 2018 could be very interesting...

[L555MAT]

Loeb: 9 titles, 78 victories, 116 podiums, 904 stage wins out of 169 starts -> 46,2% win rate, 68,6% podium rate
Ogier: 5 titles, 40 victories, 65 podiums, 498 stage wins out of 122 starts -> 32,8% win rate, 53,3% podium rate

Vettel 4 world driver titles Senna 3. Stats dont always show the full story

[L555MAT]

You mean Ogier comes into a new team who's car is not builded for him. And if it is not enough gamble, M-Sport is a half private team with less financial resources.
Ogier is champion with two teams. We saw Makkinen struggle after the switch from Mitsubishi to Subaru. Loeb hasn't make a switch. He stays with the French PSA family.

Number facts about how fast Loeb was are right. The switch to this team make him Champion in the first year at M-sport makes Ogier 'great'. For me he is.

Spot on Roy

[macebig]

I would vote for Ott. He was the guy that really upped his game this year. If he was able to stay a bit calmer during the final day of Poland, his season would have been nearly flawless. Ogier was excellent but there were so many days this season that he looked vulnerable. Nobody was there to bit him most times, so that should be a plus for him. Neuville had the most pure pace this year but the early costly mistakes and the really bad showing in NORF, undermined his challenge. JML finally managed to mount a consistent campaign for the whole season and without NORF and Poland mechanicals, he would have been even higher. Sadly, Meeke is probably lucky that he still has a contract for 2018...

[Mirek]

Vettel 4 world driver titles Senna 3. Stats dont always show the full story

That's rather bad example because Senna died as a still active contender.

I really don't understand why rally people tend to downplay what Loeb achieved. There is simply no match to that. He was dominant for a complete decade. His statistics have no match anywhere. He changed the sport and the approach to being a rally driver completely. He sent a whole generation of legends into retirement and he also managed to bring a decade long dominance to a manufacturer who was new to the sport.

[L555MAT]

That's rather bad example because Senna died as a still active contender.

I really don't understand why rally people tend to downplay what Loeb achieved. There is simply no match to that. He was dominant for a complete decade. His statistics have no match anywhere. He changed the sport and the approach to being a rally driver completely. He sent a whole generation of legends into retirement and he also managed to bring a decade long dominance to a manufacturer who was new to the sport.

Certainly not downplaying...if VW stayed long enough i think ogier would have matched his 9 wdc to make a point. Im saying i think him winning this year in a new car in a privateer team againts 3 full works teams is something special. One hell of a risk to put his reputation and legacy on the line but he did. Im fairly sure Loeb was offered a contract by Ford and even test drove the focus but decided to stay at citroen.

I still think Juha Kannkkunen is better than both and is thr GOAT. But as in my first post, thats my opinion.

[ESTR]

Real legend: Timo Salonen! we all know why. Group B (Peugeot 205), one hand, Champion 1985... and now spit on me!!!

[Adler]

Last title for loeb with xsara was actually with Kronos racing... btw he didn't even compete in the last 4 rounds...