[WRC] News & Rumours (part V) 2017

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Fixed that for you :-)

You dont think that VW took the WRC team to a new level of professionalism and car strength/reliability ? That's what all the experts said when they quit.

[dimviii]

Everyone wants the new WRC, but the volume of work, especially at M-Sport is creating some problems, albeit at a very different level from the other teams. There have been changes in the production plans for the Fiesta WRC 2017, which forced revisions to the various programs, so OneBet Jipocar ​​team confirmed today that Martin Prokop will only make his debut in the Corsican Rally, and will not go to Mexico. Morten Ostberg, the owner of the team, told AutoSport: "Nothing is decided yet, but it may happen that Martin is already in the WRC Trophy with the 2016 car, but we need more information to decide. The production timings of the Fiesta WRC 2017 are unpredictable, so we will not have the second driver anymore, "said Ostberg. Entries for the Mexico Rally ended yesterday.
This may even seem like a 'problem' on the M-Sport side, but ... far from it. Note that Citroën has three official drivers and will only have three cars there later, probably in Portugal there will already be four, Toyota, sensitively the same thing, being foreseen the debut of Esapekka Lappi only in Portugal, but M-Sport has already had three cars in Monte Carlo and will have four in Sweden. So problems, but 'above' competition ...

http://www.autosport.pt/ralis/martin...eia-no-mexico/

[denkimi]

You dont think that VW took the WRC team to a new level of professionalism and car strength/reliability ? That's what all the experts said when they quit.

i don't think VW did anything more professional then other official manufacturer teams like citroen or hyundai. Had ogier stayed at citroen, he would most likely still be a 4 times world champion, but VW wouldn't.

You build your Subaru and homologated it with Subaru Impreza denkimi F01, and if Subaru co. want to build and homologate own version it be Subaru Impreza WRC. Two homologation at same time.
But one small thing, you doesn't have those amount of money. And Subaru doesn't want spend it to WRC programme

M-Sport can build any car, but they works with Ford and they build Ford Fiesta and homologate it. Not Ford.

how sure are you about that?

[dimviii]

i don't think VW did anything more professional then other official manufacturer teams like citroen or hyundai. Had ogier stayed at citroen, he would most likely still be a 4 times world champion, but VW wouldn't.

+1

[itix]

you forgot two manu championships for ford in 2006 and 2007

He/she/it (probably he) also totally forgot the years when Ford were really competitive (like around 2003, around 2006, the era with Hirvonen etc etc).

Ford have been competitive several times. Jparker just has some weird ununderstandable beef with Ford that hasn't even been explained and refuse to see it.

[Karukera]

You dont think that VW took the WRC team to a new level of professionalism and car strength/reliability ? That's what all the experts said when they quit.

No.

They're pro as expected from a manu, improved the all time win share % vs competition and built an excellent car but one has to keep in mind it was served 4 years by the best line up any team could afford which never happened with Citroën so called dominance, Loeb being almost alone, no disrespect to Sordo and others.

Xsara, C4, DS3 were all good cars but looking at Ford results at that time it is simply reasonnable to think that both squads were technically on par, Loeb made the difference just like Ogier does now. Polo wins are >77% Ogier's.

Couple more hints from last year (and even before) with Tänak, Meeke, Neuville and Paddon strong stunts with as a result Ogier, again, way ahead of the herd, Mikkelsen 3rd behind Neuville and Latvala...

MC17, a continuing saga is underway in a Fiesta.

[seb_sh]

No.

They're pro as expected from a manu, improved the all time win share % vs competition and built an excellent car but one has to keep in mind it was served 4 years by the best line up any team could afford which never happened with Citroën so called dominance, Loeb being almost alone, no disrespect to Sordo and others.

Xsara, C4, DS3 were all good cars but looking at Ford results at that time it is simply reasonnable to think that both squads were technically on par, Loeb made the difference just like Ogier does now. Polo wins are >77% Ogier's.

Couple more hints from last year (and even before) with Tänak, Meeke, Neuville and Paddon strong stunts with as a result Ogier, again, way ahead of the herd, Mikkelsen 3rd behind Neuville and Latvala...

MC17, a continuing saga is underway in a Fiesta.

I disagree, looking at the results you can say simply that Ogier dominated but in two out of four years VW had a 1-2-3 in overall standings and in the others only Neuville spoiled the party. You have to look at their organisation and preparations outside of rallies; as a team I think they were on a higher level than Citroen was; of course the investment was also higher. You actually say it yourself, Citroen were more reliant on Loeb, he was the driving force there, a fantastic driver with a great team. Sure Ogier is also a fantastic driver but he was paired with a fantastic team.

The issue here is not that the other manufacturer teams are not pro, it's that VW took it to a higher level than any team before in the WRC.

Anecdotally: I got the chance to see their rally raid team (Dakar) operate and compare with others (Mitsubishi, Toyota, Nissan) and already there the level of professionalism in their service area was clearly much higher than anyone in that service park.

[Mirek]

It's not good to downplay the achievement.

1) Peope keep repeating that with their line-up other teams would win as well. Probably yes BUT to have such great line-up is a definitely an achievement itself. See this year's Citroën line-up with all the free drivers around. Don't You see some difference?

2) They managed to sign the best drivers even without having a car. Can You imagine Ogier signing another team which actually doesn't have anything else than a pair of S2000 cars bought from another company? VW managed to do so.

3) Their approach since the very beginning was very professional and extremely well played. The way to come into the business via taking a learning year with sister-brand's existing cars is unprecedented in the modern history of the sport.

4) They started winning right from the beginning while they had no technical problems right from the beginning. We're talking about a totally new team here and such achievement is definitely very extraordinary.

5) Even though they were totally new to the business they succeeded without relying on established suppliers. They prepared the engine themselves, they developed the dampers with totally new brand in the WRC (Sachs) etc. They took some serious risk here but it paid off.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Autosport.pt:
Jipocar ​​team confirmed today that Martin Prokop will only make his debut in the Corsican Rally, and will not go to Mexico. Morten Ostberg, the owner of the team, told AutoSport: "Nothing is decided yet, but it may happen that Martin is already in the WRC Trophy with the 2016 car, but we need more information to decide. The production timings of the Fiesta WRC 2017 are unpredictable, so we will not have the second driver anymore," said Ostberg. Entries for the Mexico Rally ended yesterday.

http://www.autosport.pt/ralis/martin...eia-no-mexico/

[Karukera]

Mirek, my response to Eddie is that they're pro like any other serious teams. I did mention the record acheivements.

Your points are unfortunately repetitive and empirically numbered.

1) They fully committed and spent their war chest (pun not intended) in the rally program, Citroën 2017 line up is a farce.

2) Any driver being offered a huge amount of money with a gigantic ambitious program would have signed up instantly.

3) Repeat of 1)

4) Other teams won from the start. They've been sitting for years watching the big boys doing the real job, learned their hard lesson from the Skoda epic fail in the WRC then gathered the money, hired good people from inside/outside VAG and eventually decided to chime in before leaving like chickens at the end of 2016, dropping 3 drivers at the very last moment.

5) Repeat of previous points.

Polo wins are way too much inequally split in Ogier's favor, fact.

My point is Ogier made the final difference. He would have acheived his records in a Fiesta, DS3 or the late I20.