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  1. #181
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirek View Post
    When talking about gr.S... how many of You guys know that Audi was doing development testing behind the iron curtain in Czechoslovakia where a local company even built a whole secret testing area according to their wishes? They tested there gr.B cars but also mid-engine prototypes as a part of gr.S development. The area is now deserted but at the early 90' it was used as a TV stage of Barum rally.
    And the end result was this beast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm53Tm7OMyQ driven by no less than Hannu Mikkola on the Goodwood Festival just some days ago.

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  3. #182
    Armchair General Mirek's Avatar
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    The RS002 was actually never in Dešná (the testing area in Czechoslovakia) but they tested a mid-engined mule using body panels from normal gr.B S1.

    It's this car on the right side of this photo from Dešná which was published more than twenty years later.


    The history of RS002 is also interesting. Roland Gumpert, boss of Audi Motorsport was keeping the development of mid-engined car secret from Ferdinand Piech because Piech insisted on using stock configuration for marketing purposes. That's why S1 was overpowered but clumsy monster. When Piech learned about existence of RS002 he ordered all prototypes to be destroyed. Gumpert destroyed two cars but kept the third one hidden for two decades before bringing it on public. Now it's one of the most valuable prototypes...

    Revman, sorry for hijacking Your thread
    Last edited by Mirek; 6th July 2017 at 20:50.
    Stupid is as stupid does. Forrest Gump

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  5. #183
    Senior Member OldF's Avatar
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    On the web page macebig posted few days ago is also the history of group S.
    https://rallygroupbshrine.org/group-s/group-s-history/
    Lower on the page is a “short lived rumour” of the group X.

    Another story about group S
    http://www.racecar-engineering.com/a...lying-group-s/

    I knew I had something in my favourites about group S and I found this. I had not read it my selves so had to take some time to read it. It’s related to same story Mirek told about. Funny story (don’t tell the boss).
    https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threa...y-cars.181687/


    In 1990 there was also rumours, or was what said of it, it was more than a rumour, of a new group called R or RR as it was called in another context. It was supposed to start at the beginning of 1994 but on the second half of the year the group R got resistance from manufactures, drivers and organizers whom opinion was that group A cars are enough rally cars and it was buried at the end of 1990.

    In 1990 the group A cars had nice power figures so maybe the drivers was afraid the new group would give them some pussy machinery.
    “Don’t eat the yellow snow” Frank Zappa

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  7. #184
    Member Revman's Avatar
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    A question about Poland.....As I understand it, Ogier called for his gravel crew to asses the conditions before the start of at least one of the days when others did not. Is this correct? Is this what makes him special? Why wouldn't others do the same?

    Related question....Is the gravel crew the same as the weather crew? Kind of heard both terms thrown around.

  8. #185
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    New to WRC--How should I watch and what should I watch for

    Quote Originally Posted by Revman View Post

    Related question....Is the gravel crew the same as the weather crew? Kind of heard both terms thrown around.
    Weather crew just walks on the stage and measures the temperature of the road and sees the weather condition for tyre selection and setup choices. Gravel crew drives through the stage before the competitors and reports changes in road condition for pace note additions. Allowed now only in tarmac events.

  9. #186
    Armchair General Mirek's Avatar
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    Weather crew can be basically anyone who is on stage and is in contact with the team. Even I was few times while I was basically just a spectator.
    Stupid is as stupid does. Forrest Gump

  10. #187
    Member Revman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnttiL View Post
    Weather crew just walks on the stage and measures the temperature of the road and sees the weather condition for tyre selection and setup choices. Gravel crew drives through the stage before the competitors and reports changes in road condition for pace note additions. Allowed now only in tarmac events.
    Thank you. Why wouldn't WRC allow gravel crews for gravel/snow, etc.?

  11. #188
    Armchair General Mirek's Avatar
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    Because it's not very helpful. On gravel or snow You always have somewhat slippery conditions and those further change with more and more cars passing (grip usually first getting better but than ruts starting to appear etc.).

    On tarmac it's very different. There is very high level of grip where there is clean asphalt but sudden changes with some dirt, water etc. make it tricky and sometimes dangerous. That's why rules allow gravel crews on asphalt events.
    Stupid is as stupid does. Forrest Gump

  12. #189
    Member Revman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirek View Post
    Because it's not very helpful. On gravel or snow You always have somewhat slippery conditions and those further change with more and more cars passing (grip usually first getting better but than ruts starting to appear etc.).

    On tarmac it's very different. There is very high level of grip where there is clean asphalt but sudden changes with some dirt, water etc. make it tricky and sometimes dangerous. That's why rules allow gravel crews on asphalt events.
    Thank you.

  13. #190
    Armchair General Mirek's Avatar
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    I forgot to mention where the gravel crew is the most important - Monte Carlo (it's also asphalt event per official classification). There they are used foremost to locate icy patches, especially black ice. Monte Carlo is the most tricky event in terms of conditions of all.
    Stupid is as stupid does. Forrest Gump

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