Where is the UK headed?

[Mark]

I do despair a bit at the moment. We seem to be headed down an isolationist path, especially ahead of next years general election. Politicians seem to be keen to be cracking down on immigration and those nasty foreigners, even to the extent of leaving the European Union to achieve it.

I believe the whole Europe issue is a massive distraction to the issues the country really faces in terms of getting the economy turned around. But hey, it's always nice to blame someone or something instead.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Hit the nail on the head!

I had a dream the other night that the Ukips won a further three MPs in bye-elections. The way things are going we could have a Conservative/Ukip coalition after the next general election.

I've said this before, but the problem with the EU is that it is a difficult sell. Everything in the media about the EU is reported as a negative. None of the positive things that the EU gives us is fairly reported, so you end up with a ridiculous situation were people like farmers, whose industry relies heavily on CAP subsidies, vote for Euro-sceptic parties. I bet you could take a sample survey of workers from the Sunderland Nissan plant and many would say they were anti-EU, completely ignorant to the fact their job exists because of the UK being part of the EU.

One of the main reason for this swing to the right in our politics is that the majority of voters are older voters. And as a generalisation older people tend to be less sympathetic when it comes to things like immigration and foreign aid. People of my generation aren't voting and as a result the main political parties aren't going to waste time with policy that might get their vote.

Another reason is that people are just generally ignorant when it comes to subjects like illegal immigration, refugees and foreign aid. People seem to think that all our foreign aid is spent on Pakistan's nuclear weapons and all refugees are here to take our benefits (how all of these Somalian children without any parents or school education are aware of the UK welfare system is amazing isn't it?).

None of this is important to the reality of my life. I'm in my 20s and really want to buy my own house, but none of the political parties seem bothered that houses in London are inflating by 20% per year. Sure, net increase in migration and general population increase affects the housing market, but it isn't the main cause. Get more Romanians and Poles over here to build us some affordable housing!

[Starter]

Another reason is that people are just generally ignorant when it comes to subjects like illegal immigration, refugees and foreign aid. People seem to think that all our foreign aid is spent on Pakistan's nuclear weapons and all refugees are here to take our benefits (how all or these Somalian children without any parents or school education are aware of the UK welfare system is amazing isn't it?).

You seem to have much the same immigration issue that we have in the US, except yours isn't Hispanic based. Part of the problem is that, while most are just looking for a better life, there is a large enough minority who are happy to have a free ride and that creates the basis for painting them all that way.

One of the issues with large immigrant populations is that the economy can only absorb just so many over a given period of time. Particularly when the economy is struggling. Then you have the people who do have jobs beginning to resent the "free loaders" and voting that way. My solution would be to control immigration at a sustainable level and use the money saved (from benefits) to invest in the countries when the immigrants originated in order to boost the economy there and eliminate some of the impetus to leave. Realizing that the governments (and I use the term loosely) in some of those countries are problimatical at best and usually corrupt so getting bang for the buck would be difficult.

[steveaki13]

I do despair a bit at the moment. We seem to be headed down an isolationist path, especially ahead of next years general election. Politicians seem to be keen to be cracking down on immigration and those nasty foreigners, even to the extent of leaving the European Union to achieve it.

I believe the whole Europe issue is a massive distraction to the issues the country really faces in terms of getting the economy turned around. But hey, it's always nice to blame someone or something instead.

It seems a lot of the population want that approach too though.

Either side of the debate seem to think the other is being bluffed or is not thinking straight.

Fact is most do. They believe whichever side they are on is the right path.

Trouble is the sides are so far apart, what happens to the people on the side that lose is unclear. It could lead to massive trouble.

[MrJan]

You seem to have much the same immigration issue that we have in the US, except yours isn't Hispanic based. Part of the problem is that, while most are just looking for a better life, there is a large enough minority who are happy to have a free ride and that creates the basis for painting them all that way.

Yup, the problem is that no one really knows how many create that minority. Over here we probably have more people like this scumbag http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-s...wales-29714408 than we do immigrants over here to live off the state. Having worked for a company that did maintenance on social housing, I have more experience of people born in the UK sponging off the state than I have people born overseas (although, to be fair, I do live in one of the whitest and most inbred parts of the country).

[steveaki13]

(although, to be fair, I do live in one of the whitest and most inbred parts of the country).

Wow. Not a fan of the South West then

[Rollo]

Then you have the people who do have jobs beginning to resent the "free loaders" and voting that way. My solution would be to control immigration at a sustainable level and use the money saved (from benefits) to invest in the countries when the immigrants originated in order to boost the economy there and eliminate some of the impetus to leave. Realizing that the governments (and I use the term loosely) in some of those countries are problimatical at best and usually corrupt so getting bang for the buck would be difficult.

Is immigration the real cause here? Really? Really?!

If you were to do an actual economic analysis of actual "freeloading" who is more at fault? People on benefits, or the members of the DJIA, the FT-SE or the ASX 200?

http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-e...#ixzz3GosJfjSK
The 90-page look at the the tax contributions of the S&P/ASX 200 between 2004 and 2013 – the first research of its kind attempted – claims up to $80 billion was foregone by the taxman over that period; a sum of money that could all but wipe out the government's past two budget deficits.
- Sydney Morning Herald, 29th Sep 2014.

I bet that that's the same for the UK, the US as it is in Australia.

[Rudy Tamasz]

The Ukay is headed nowhere. Has always been. I do sound optimistic and cheerful this morning, don't I? :waive:

[MrJan]

Wow. Not a fan of the South West then

Quite the opposite. I was born in Exeter and, bar 3 years at uni (when I was in Falmouth) have lived here my whole life. It's a glorious place, fantastic countryside and close to the sea and some great beaches. Having lived here for that long though I'm aware of how rarely I see someone that doesn't have white skin, so naturally I'm more likely to bump into good ol' fashioned local benefits cheats.

[driveace]

Same here.Live in a nice part of the country and don't have the issues that are prevalent in other parts of the country .
Think the big thing that people se is that we pay into the EU pot 50 million EVERY DAY !
And I and them do not see we get that value back
I go down to Spain ,there only last week too ,AND they have superb quiet dual carriageways that are deserted,,every time I go there they are building houses,roads ,gardens ,are they are supposed to be going belly up .So the money has to come from the EU .There are also too many lazy people who are work shy here ,claiming all the benefits they get pushed towards them ,even getting advise at the job centers of how to milk the system !Then I as a pensioner get £104 per week to live on ,whilst on benefits some are on £550 per week .We see the gravy train in Brussels ,the money waisted,now a deputy for Junker ,who is as Junker says been my mate for a long time .Some feel the EU is taking the pi** Can we not see the light ? I don't have a problem with immigrants ,but Jesus why do they come from Lybia,Afghanistan,Syria,passing through Germany Italy France to get to the UK ? Somebody ,somewhere are told them there is a pot of gold here for them to share