How good is Vettel?

[Zico]

Damon hill is just as good as his father even being cheated out of a title by Schumacher!

Even putting Schucrasher in the same league as senna is a joke he won so many titles in a car head and shoulders above the rest!
We saw him in a Mercedes and he was extremely average!

I think Mikes age caught up with him somewhat but I don't think he was 'average'. I just think Nico is better than a lot give him credit for, I guess this season will allow us to determine just how good.

[rjbetty]

Damon hill is just as good as his father even being cheated out of a title by Schumacher!

Even putting Schucrasher in the same league as senna is a joke he won so many titles in a car head and shoulders above the rest!
We saw him in a Mercedes and he was extremely average!

Come on I don't think it's quite like that.

1994 - Benetton 2nd best car behind Williams
1995 - Benetton 2nd or 3rd best behind Williams. Brawn always said it was actually an average car with an excellent engine and driver. Look what Alesi and Berger did the following year. Michael said the 1995 Ferrari could have won the title, yet people say he's just saying that. He could just be telling the truth too - I'll go with that one for now.

2000 - I personally believe the McLaren was actually better and that Coulthard didn't really have more than a 0.2sec advantage in pure speed as a driver over Barrichello!
2001 - Contrary to popular belief, I reckon the Ferrari was only 0.1sec quicker than the McLaren. In fact, I think Williams were slightly quicker on average (I mean the mean, though the median might be more accurate; scuse the maths speak)
2002 - Ok I'll give this one. A slight edge on ahem 'mean' in quali, much more in the races.
2003 - Well actually, yes a dominant car. BUT all the factors, new rules, michelin tyres caused this to be distinctly evened out, or even maybe behind slightly. I mean Barrichello was 4th on 65pts. Was he really THAT much worse than JPM and Kimi who were only in their 3rd seasons?
2004 - I think this car was the best in 2004, but hardly McLaren 98 stuff.


As for Mercedes, I think Michael was older, very rusty, unable to test and practice, and Nico is just underrated.

[dj_bytedisaster]

Damon hill is just as good as his father even being cheated out of a title by Schumacher!

Even putting Schucrasher in the same league as senna is a joke he won so many titles in a car head and shoulders above the rest!
We saw him in a Mercedes and he was extremely average!

That stuff you're smoking - you better lay it off. I'm pretty sure it's unhealthy if not even illegal. Damon Hill was a solid driver, but other than in the ridiculously superior Newey cars of 93-96 he was utterly mediocre. He was beaten by Ralf Schumacher for crying out loud and that more than once...

[Coulthard Fan]

Not being funny but the Benneton had electronic aids that were banned!! If that's not a huge advantage I don't no what is!

I'm sorry but nobody will change my opinion on the bloke! Some of the things he did in his career are unforgivable!
Mr Schucrasher proved that in a PROPER midfield car he was knowhere but the barrier most of the time!

[Coulthard Fan]

Utterly mediocre I'm sorry but DJ what are you smoking!? He should have been a double world champion he was cheated out of it! Ask anybody Murray Walker for an example he still firmly believes Schucrasher should have been Disqualified!

[dj_bytedisaster]

Utterly mediocre I'm sorry but DJ what are you smoking!? He should have been a double world champion he was cheated out of it! Ask anybody Murray Walker for an example he still firmly believes Schucrasher should have been Disqualified!

Still doesn't change the fact that Hill was only world champion in a car that was as superior as the 2011 RB if not even more. He 'achieved' the very thing that you and your bestest hate-buddy Gary lambast Vettel for ad nauseam. When Hill was in a midfield car (Arrows, Jordan) he did exactly nothing. When Schumacher was in midfield cars (Benetton 1992-1993, Ferrari 1996) he scored five wins against the likes of Mansell, Prost and Senna. Comparing these two is like comparing hare and turtle...

[rjbetty]

Not being funny but the Benneton had electronic aids that were banned!! If that's not a huge advantage I don't no what is!

I'm sorry but nobody will change my opinion on the bloke! Some of the things he did in his career are unforgivable!
Mr Schucrasher proved that in a PROPER midfield car he was knowhere but the barrier most of the time!

Check out the 1991 Belgian Grand Prix. in which Schumacher outqualified Spa expert Andrea de Cesaris by a big margin. I remember reading around 1999 of how de Cesaris just looked lost in the debrief when Michael described how he was driving round a certain Problem the Jordan car was experiencing.

Then consider that de Cesaris retired from 2nd on lap 42 on 44, closing in on an ailing Senna and looking on course to pass him. I'll let you do the maths.

[rjbetty]

Utterly mediocre I'm sorry but DJ what are you smoking!? He should have been a double world champion he was cheated out of it! Ask anybody Murray Walker for an example he still firmly believes Schucrasher should have been Disqualified!

Hmmm but Hill only truly beat Schumacher once all year, and that was only by the 3.3 seconds that Murray screamed.

He was only anywhere near Michael in the points because the FIA kept on disqualifying him, for a 1/4 of the races. I don't want to peddle childish conspiracy theories, but I do consider the possibilty that the FIA's decisions may have been influenced somewhat by their concern of having a close championship fight.

At the time, it was known that the FIA were very concerned about TV viewing figures etc. This had been an issue during 1993 and the reduced figures led to all the driver aids being banned for '94.

[Mia 01]

Three times champion in a row and runner up the year before. I don´t care about the car, Seb is one of the Great!

[dj_bytedisaster]

Three times champion in a row and runner up the year before. I don´t care about the car, Seb is one of the Great!

Well, you can't discard the car completely. If it doesn't fit him, he fades a bit, unlike Schumacher or Senna, who could win even in crap cars. Vettel has only managed that twice - the Torro Rosso in 2008 and last year at Bahrain, when he won despite the car fitting Webber's style more than his. He still has a way to go until he could be considered a truly great. I would say he's on Piquet's level. (Nelson sr. that is )
If given a competetive car, he delivers reliably.