1983 WRC, ERC and National Championships

[Mig007]

Hello

I am planning to write an annual about 1983 on Rallying, and I have been making a lot of reserach on this and other forums. First of all, I'd like to know if you know more websites with photos, results, entry lists, etc; about rallying.
And in second place I'd like to ask if it's possible to list the European Rally Championships races, with coefficients and winners ( I have some mismatches with the races' calendar), and also to know your opinion about the main contenders for the title. Usually, ERC had so variable entry lists due to its nature that it's sometimes difficult to find who were the "prioritaires" on the entry lists.

Many Thanks

[FAL]

I have the entry list for Ypres (ERC Coeff 20) and I think I have the results.
The French "Forum Auto" is the only other site I am aware of that could help. The "BritishRallyForum" would largely be a waste of time, as few there are proper rally historians.
Make sure that in anything you produce for English-speaking countries you do not refer to rallies as "races" - I know the same word is used for both in many european languages but calling a rally a race severely grates with all UK and some other countries' true enthusisats!
In the UK at least, the ERC has never been a significant interest and few would recall who were the main contenders in any one year. As one who competed in the odd event, the general impression remains that whoever was the most favoured Lancia satellite team driver at the time was the one who would win the ERC!

[Mig007]

You raced in rallies??? I know the French and the British forum and I agree with you, and I use the French forum a lot, I've established some contacts there already

[FAL]

No, I rallied in rallies!

[Mig007]

Hahahah why those question between rally and race in some countries?

[D-Type]

Hahahah why those question between rally and race in some countries?

Quite simple - different languages say things differently.

A potted history of the development of motor sport in Britain may help to explain that here, the word 'racing' has a particularly narrow meaning.
In Britain racing on closed public roads has never been permitted so circuit racing evolved on purpose-built race tracks : Brooklands, Donington Park, Crystal Palace and various beaches prewar and Silverstone, Goodwood, Snetterton and other airfield circuits, Brands Hatch, Aintree, Oulton Park etc postwar. So a race was always on a closed circuit that was not public roads.
In parallel with racing at Brooklands, hillclimbs developed. Initially these were on little-used public roads, with the police 'turning a blind eye' but after a couple of fatal accidents, possibly involving spectators, even these were banned and hillclimbs could only take place on private roads on private land - principally Shelsley Walsh and Prescott. But as these involved cars running one at a time against the clock, they were not considered to be races, otherwise they would definitely have been banned.
A traditional British rally did not simply comprise getting from A to B, it required following a predetermined route by solving clues at a set average speed. You could be penalised for being early as wella s being late. Often a special 'driving test' was included requiring going in and out of 'garages' around pylons and stopping just after crossing a line. As it was a test of navigational skills (map reading, clue solving etc) and driving skill rather than an out-and-out speed contest it was not a 'race' and could be held on public roads. Later flat out special stages on private ground were introduced leading to the present format.

So, in Britain a driver competes in various forms of motor sport but only races in circuit races. Otherwise he'll be in trouble with the law for racing on public roads.

I hope that brief and very simplified explanation helps

[FAL]

D type has replied with the main historical reason while I was unsuccessfully attempting to re-size a photo to make it meet the near impossible dimensions reqired for this forum. Life is too short for the number of resizing attempts needed...

The careful separation of race and rally terminology was so vital in the UK due to insurance implications. Even today, some (but not many) road car insurance policies include rallying (meaning the public road sections of rallies - not special stages) but never include racing. The sport's UK governing body, the MSA, saw the difference as particularly important when one long standing insurer covered event officials etc. for many years without question. Since UK motorsport insurance was put out to tender (against the wishes of the MSA) (and achieved an overnight cost saving of 20%) it is less important, as the insurance industry's comprehension of the difference is better. Conversely, there is a relatively new threat from illegal racing on the public road by the "big stereo" clowns and the consequent risk that insurers may clamp down on anything related to "speed", so separating rallying from racing as something very different remains important. You can still see the legacy of all this in UK stage rallies. In most countries penalties are accrued against "scratch" ie. zero/real time. Here there is a "bogey time" for every stage and penalties are accrued only when that time is exceeded.
The careful use of "race" and "rally" has remained and extends to other english-speaking nations (eg. someone in New Zealand has recently raised the point on another forum).

[FAL]

As for main 83 ERC contenders, I didn't notice them on the rally I did - but I noticed Antonella Mandelli in another Lancia 037. She was certainly a contender for an award - but not the overall ERC!

=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/203/copyofantonellamandelll.jpg/]

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[Mig007]

Thanks for the explanation. I had some knowledge of the problem of the public roads use on UK and other countries, but I didn't know that it had such an impact on the language. I''ll hope to be correct in the future everywhere I write.
Antonella Mandelli is an icon from the rallies in the 80's, with Michele Mouton, but with much less success; although she had made some good results with a Jolly Club Lancia 037, including a 3rd place at the Madeira Rally precisely in 83.