Wrc Rally Argentina 2011

[Rallyper]

It's irrelevant because Loeb's 1 minute penalty didn't fit the crime so he still beat Hirvonen by 59 sec. Loeb is clearly the deserved winner! Case closed.

That´s simplifying the case very much. The one minute penalty was undoubtable and is added to the times on stages. Loeb was in the margin of being one or two depending on the roundabout passing. For me Mikko is moral winner.

[darkstar]

here´s a video of that roundabout:Organización admite que hubo desprolijidades, pero dice que Sebastian Loeb ganó bien

you can clearely see that the citroens gained a pretty big advantage by shortcutting that roundabout.

once again citroen has more luck then what is normal. instead of getting a penalty, the argentina rallye organisators get a penatly and need to pay 5000€.

same in sweden, where loeb´s gear got stuck or whatever and solberg pushed the car away. or ogier leaving the road as shown in the roadbook by turning into sarvice to early. how can they always get away with stuff like that? especially the thing in sweden...

[Bobcat]

+1

[JAM]

It's irrelevant because Loeb's 1 minute penalty didn't fit the crime so he still beat Hirvonen by 59 sec. Loeb is clearly the deserved winner! Case closed.

Irrelevant is your point of view about the Loeb's penalty.

By your pont of view the winner should be Ogier. Subtracting mistakes...

[wwbroe]

That´s simplifying the case very much. The one minute penalty was undoubtable and is added to the times on stages. Loeb was in the margin of being one or two depending on the roundabout passing. For me Mikko is moral winner.

Maybe he should show sometimes on the stages that he deserves to be a winner, he could do that by setting some besttimes.....

[Rallyper]

Maybe he should show sometimes on the stages that he deserves to be a winner, he could do that by setting some besttimes.....

We turn your say the other way around and let´s say Citroen show they win without cheating.

[MikeD]

We turn your say the other way around and let´s say Citroen show they win without cheating.

Pffff!

Quite an impressive cheating rate they have at Citroën. 6 manu titles and 7 driver's titles by cheating ... wow! ... They have fooled all of us, but a good thing you made us aware of all their cheating

Maybe Ford should just change their approch to the WRC. It's pathetic the lack of titles despite their long involvement in the sport. The managament is not good enough. The reliability is not good enough. Their drivers aren't fast enough. That's why they keep losing and then you can all stand on the side shouting "cheaters" at their opponents instead of focusing on where the issue of the lack of results really are!

[ZequeArgentina]

My understanding of th Roundabout issue is that:
1- Organizers did the roadbook, picturing both ways of the roundabout as valid.
2- Manufacturers teams (probably Ford) took this issue at a meeting prior to the stage
3- There was a propossal to agree that everyone was to take the outside way
4- Citroen did not agree (therefore, agreement is not valid)
5- First pass, there was a tape in the roundabout
6- This tape is wrongly placed, as the roadbook allow drivers to use this path, even if later the intention was to forbid it (it was just and intention, no real official modification of the route)
7- Local news say it was Borrione (safety agent from local organizer), and not Bartoz, who take the tape out. Which is of no importance,
8- Citroens took an acepted way, as well as Fords
9- No reason for penalizing any driver, as nobody run through a route ot of place
10- Organzers hadfautl in the confussion, its isright to penalize them


Imagine you are a driver who had your notes based on the shorter way, why would you accept a forbid of that option, andrun without noteson that roundabout, while your rivals are in the opposite case.
No way!

[Oppositelock]

@ ZequeArgentina

There is nothing to add, if you look only at the facts, which is exactly what the stewards had to do.

On the other hand this incidents shows perfectly who is the predator and who is the prey inside WRC. You don't win championships by being the nice guy. Unfortunately, one might add

[N.O.T]

LOL...keep going...this is getting really funny....