WRCar 10 & 11 - Time difference

[traxx]

It seems that the DS3 is fast as the C4 in slow gravel

[Hartusvuori]

Juho Hänninen won N4 in NORF with Skoda both 2009 and 2010. In 2009 he was 10th overall and was 2,48 sec/km slower than the winner. In 2010 he was 9th overall and 1,76 sec/km (0,72 sec/km faster than 2009) slower than the winner. Does this improvement tell something about the improvements of the S2000 cars?

And you got to take in consideration that on Rally Finland's final day Hänninen wasn't motivated to push to the maximum and on Day 2 times he was actually some 18 secs slower that Jarkko Nikara (super rally) on Peugeot 207 S2000, who was fastest S2000 driver.

It would be interesting to see some comparative times from M-Sport's Cumbria track that they must have tested with Focus WRC(s) ad nauseum and are now testing Fiesta WRC there. And of course same with DS3 WRC from Citroen's equal testing roads, if there are such.

Should we calculate beforehand the secs per km statistics for next season's rallies and especially for stages that are the same? Is there any other RG1 out than Sweden's? There should be, right?

[janvanvurpa]

My guess is 0,4-0,8 sec/km (depending on the type of rally) in the beginning. By the end of season half of that. During 2010 2011WRC will catch up with 2010WRC.

Juho Hänninen won N4 in NORF with Skoda both 2009 and 2010. In 2009 he was 10th overall and was 2,48 sec/km slower than the winner. In 2010 he was 9th overall and 1,76 sec/km (0,72 sec/km faster than 2009) slower than the winner. Does this improvement tell something about the improvements of the S2000 cars?

Patrik Flodin with Subaru won the traditional N4 in 2009 (13th overall) and he was 3,48 sec/km (1 sec/km compared to Juho) slower than the winner. In 2010 the winner was Ott Tänak (18th overall, more S2000 in 2010) and he was 2,97 sec/km (1,21 sec/km compared to Juho) slower than the winner.

I expect the gap will be bigger for 2011WRC in rallies where there is more acceleration from low speed (tight corners, junctions and hairpins). These kinds of rallies prefer cars with more torque like the 2010WRC.

Have we forgotten that what the engine makes for torque, but then the gearbox and especially the final drive multiplies it. So less toque at the motor, then shorter gear in th axle --if you need "ax".

Top speed then becomes just a question of revs in top...
Hejsan! from John---with 5.45 slutdrev i rally Saab

[OldF]

Have we forgotten that what the engine makes for torque, but then the gearbox and especially the final drive multiplies it. So less toque at the motor, then shorter gear in th axle --if you need "ax".

Top speed then becomes just a question of revs in top...
Hejsan! from John---with 5.45 slutdrev i rally Saab

Yes, this time we did forget it.

That’s one question. Will the 1.6TWRC have the same top speed as 2.0TWRC. If they settle with little less top speed, the result can be different.

[Mirek]

We should also consider different tyres for 2011. The comparison from same stages won't be valid for that.

Anyway it may be interesting to see which sets of gears each car use. There are big differences in S2000 cars (I don't mean top speed but all particular gears). Now the cars will have much shorter power bent, so it will be more important than in old WRC cars.

[Sulland]

Different tyres is a good point, and make the comparison much harder of course.

[Juha_Koo]

We should also consider different tyres for 2011. The comparison from same stages won't be valid for that.

And this brought to my mind that what kind of tyres are we going to see in Sweden. The "new" wide snow tyres or those "old" narrow tyres? Too damn tired to browse the rules.

[Mirek]

New wide ones but from Michelin...

[N.O.T]

on fast rallies the difference will not be significant...on slower ones its going to be more than 1 sec.km

[TKM]

Unfortunately for Ford and Mini, I think the DS3 will be pretty much on the pace of the current cars from the word go and by the end of the year probably quicker.

The same thing happened when they went from Group B to Group A. With half the power the group A cars were initially a lot slower, but with the advancements in suspension technology and what not, it wasn't long until they were setting times quicker than the old group B cars.