TEAM money cut from Conquest and Coyne

[Chris R]

and on this ride-buyer issue - we need to separate the economics of racing from talent. Just because a driver is better at attracting sponsorship (perhaps through family ties even) than a team does not mean he or she does not have talent or deserve a shot....

Duno is not bad because she bought her ride in and of itself. She is bad because she cannot drive..... Yes, she would not have a drive in a system that only rewarded talent - but racing has NEVER been just about talent it has ALWAYS been about money and personality too - there is no point in dreaming for "good old days" that never existed....

go with some version of the 107% rule and this problem will more or less solve itself..... Also, require an FIA superlicense or equivalent if you really want to hit the issue with both barrels.... leave the economic fact/necessity of ride-buuying out of the discussion.....

[Scotty G.]

Why? Because Scotty G says so? What if he is perfectly happy just competing at the level of commitment he currently has and not interested in trying to take on Penske and Ganassi?

Gary

Yes, he's perfectly happy to fill the field and keep taking checks from anyone who will give him one.

Forget about competing with Penske and Ganassi. How about just competing period? He's had a team since the late 1980's. And yet, its still about scraping by and doing the minimum.

[Scotty G.]

He is the classic underdog.

He's also loaded beyond belief.

Quit whining Dale about losing a welfare check for one of your entries you put no effort into last year (because if you take Duno on, you are not serious).

Go out and actually do what other big boy owners in racing do....find money ON YOUR OWN. Coyne might be a swell guy but he is the poster-child for what has been wrong with Indy Car Racing in the last 2 decades.

And why Penske and Ganassi kick everyone's ass every single year.

[garyshell]

Forget about competing with Penske and Ganassi. How about just competing period?

And why Penske and Ganassi kick everyone's ass every single year.

So which is it? Out of one side of your mouth he doesn't need to compete with them, out of the other you berate him because he doesn't.

Gary

[Hoop-98]

and on this ride-buyer issue - we need to separate the economics of racing from talent. Just because a driver is better at attracting sponsorship (perhaps through family ties even) than a team does not mean he or she does not have talent or deserve a shot....

Duno is not bad because she bought her ride in and of itself. She is bad because she cannot drive..... Yes, she would not have a drive in a system that only rewarded talent - but racing has NEVER been just about talent it has ALWAYS been about money and personality too - there is no point in dreaming for "good old days" that never existed....

go with some version of the 107% rule and this problem will more or less solve itself..... Also, require an FIA superlicense or equivalent if you really want to hit the issue with both barrels.... leave the economic fact/necessity of ride-buuying out of the discussion.....

I have been thinking of this '107PCT' rule and how it might be implemented.

Let's look at Duno's practice speeds.



Except for Watkins Glen she was averaging over 110 pct of the leader in practice and three times she was held out of qualifying.

Later, after "probation" she was making the 107 cut.


A couple of thoughts, 107 on the current ovals seems high.

If a person has trouble in practice and can't hit 107 should they be allowed to attempt to qualify>

Should their be something like 109 in practice allows an attempt to make 107, over 109 in practice (Road Courses) no qualifying attempts?

Thoughts?

[Chris R]

He's also loaded beyond belief.

Quit whining Dale about losing a welfare check for one of your entries you put no effort into last year (because if you take Duno on, you are not serious).

Go out and actually do what other big boy owners in racing do....find money ON YOUR OWN. Coyne might be a swell guy but he is the poster-child for what has been wrong with Indy Car Racing in the last 2 decades.

And why Penske and Ganassi kick everyone's ass every single year.

I suspect Roger and Chip have far more money than Dale and it is irrelevant anyway....

I understand your call to action for Dale to step it up - but by the same token, I fail to see how he is different from the field filler teams of the past.... and I fail to see how the support survives without at least some people like him....

I also am not so sure the "big boys" do as much sponsor finding as the past... If Rahal goes to Ganassi - is he now a "ride buyer" because he drummed up his own sponsorship? What about Andretti taking Mutoh? You mean to tell me that Danica is a not de facto "ride buyer" (because those sponsor do not care about Andretti - they care about Danica)....

[ykiki]

...if you take Duno on, you are not serious.

Does this mean we should hate on Dreyer & Reinbold even more than DC? After all, Coyne has only had her for a season but D&R kept bringing her back!

Dale Coyne will manage to survive with or (hopefully) without Duno. He's had some rather good drivers (Justin Wilson, Alex Barron, Townsend Bell, Christiano DeMatta, Roberto Moreno, Oriol Servia, Paul Tracy, Bruno Junqueira), some not so good (Joel Camathias, Dennis Vitolo), and well, Duno is in a class all by herself.

Go out and actually do what other big boy owners in racing do....find money ON YOUR OWN. Coyne might be a swell guy but he is the poster-child for what has been wrong with Indy Car Racing in the last 2 decades.

I remember when DC ran cars with Sonny's BBQ livery and people actually complained because Coyne owned Sonny's franchises. "They're not a real sponsor" they'd say. Somehow funding his team out of his own pocket was deemed to be a bad thing. Seems like people won't be happy no matter what he does.

Dale Coyne seems like the kind of guy who keeps racing and busting his butt to field a team because he has FUN with it and he's entertained by it. Someone had better fill him in that sports are not supposed to be fun - they're a serious business - and that if he can't compete on the same level as the big boys, then he should take his ball and go home.

You know, Dale Coyne will be just fine whether he's getting TEAM money or not. It's Conquest who'll probably suffer...

[Scotty G.]

I understand your call to action for Dale to step it up - but by the same token, I fail to see how he is different from the field filler teams of the past.... and I fail to see how the support survives without at least some people like him....

I am in no way saying we would be better off without the field-filler teams.

But, its Coyne coming out and whining in Robin's recent article, that galls me. He knew exactly what he was doing, taking on Milka. He was (as he almost always has done), taking the check and doing very little on his own. He's been doing that for the better part of 25 years now.

Randy Bernard has made it very clear (and this drop to 22, makes it even more clear).....either get serious and hire real race drivers or get off the gravy train.

Milka Duno and the grab bag of ride buyers Conquest employed in their 2nd car, ain't gonna cut it. Nor should it. This is supposed to be big boy, professional racing.

And, what has Coyne done in his 25 years or so in the sport, to help in the feeder series? An Indy Lights team? An Atlantics team? Star Mazda? USAC? Anything? Anything in any other form of racing?

Again Dale is a good guy and a pioneer type of owner. But he has also gotten VERY rich over the years, from sticking his hand out.

[Scotty G.]

I remember when DC ran cars with Sonny's BBQ livery and people actually complained because Coyne owned Sonny's franchises. "They're not a real sponsor" they'd say. Somehow funding his team out of his own pocket was deemed to be a bad thing. Seems like people won't be happy no matter what he does.

Yes, I remember those Sonny's cars from a few years ago.

Of course, it was Mario Moraes's family check, who was funding that car. Not Dale. And because Tony George gave him free chassis and free engine leases, it was a nice, easy year of collecting for DCR.

[anthonyvop]

If a person has trouble in practice and can't hit 107 should they be allowed to attempt to qualify>

Should their be something like 109 in practice allows an attempt to make 107, over 109 in practice (Road Courses) no qualifying attempts?

Thoughts?

Practice is just that....Practice. With limited testing it is one of the only times they can try new things. Leave it alone.

Right now the grids are not big enough for there to be a need for pre-qualifying. If the grid grows then perhaps it will be needed.

How about this?
For Road course: Have a 20 min pre-qualifying session immediately after final practice for any driver who didn't make the 107% the race before?

For Ovals the time that each cars spends qualifying is so short that there is no need for pre-qualifying.