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5th June 2010, 08:07 #51
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Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
The thing is Jag, the money isn't there, but the racing is dull. If you cannot find any way to spread the field, make passing happen, make something happen, and add uncertainty into all the races, not just the ones with rain, then it is a dead issue anyhow. The only way they get back sponsor attention is if they put a better show on at every opportunity on every type of track in every market. They have the car count now to make it happen. I think they have to an extent the number of talented guys and gals behind the wheel to make for a decent series, but there is NO room for the cars to evolve as it stands now. Brian Barnhart legislated this series in to a static death spiral.
It may have to take some awkward steps to get out of it, but I think it can be done. Lets put it this way Jag, it HAS to be done. They are just treading water right now....and that is an optimistic look. Scotty and other D and G guys would say they are dead man walking. I notice they wont quit kicking the body tho."Water for my horses, beer for my men and mud for my turtle".
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5th June 2010, 11:23 #52
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Originally Posted by call_me_andrew
Really?
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5th June 2010, 11:39 #53
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Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
However, I don't think the dull racing is due to a spec formula as much as it is due to the formula itself. GP2 is a spec series yet they manage to have more teams and drivers win.
I'm not saying that the IRL should stay a spec series, but those who advocate "opening up the rules" to "open up the competition" are spending other people's money. Right now, IRL teams cannot afford to "open up their wallets."
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5th June 2010, 18:46 #54
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Originally Posted by px400r
The racing is dull because everyone is in the same box, with the same stuff, and even though Penske and Ganassi can tune and tweak things better, and have the better drivers, they cannot really even race each other in an entertaining fashion."Water for my horses, beer for my men and mud for my turtle".
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5th June 2010, 22:49 #55
Great discussions. I have quite an essay in my head also, but I don't feel like writing it all right now.
Mark In O's points about spec chassis are spot on... everybody is even, & it takes a gigantic effort to get a very small gain. Only the very richest & best run teams will ever find that gain, and the small teams will never even accidentally have the fastest car for the weekend.
What makes Indycar even worse is the mandated spec is a dull, slow, downforce-heavy setup. (slow being relative... they are extremely fast, just slow compared to F1 & CART) To GP2's credit, their spec is rather racy, you get a lot of very close on-track action.
How much better would the show be if Indycar's current chassis spec had 100 more HP, another 100 in PTP, half the ground-effect downforce, & ran superspeedway wings everywhere?N.Hayden L.Hamilton D.Earnhardt R.Gordon S.Speed T.Stewart J.P.Montoya G.Rahal Ferrari Lotus
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5th June 2010, 23:10 #56Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
In supposed "top tier" series, I'm not in favor of spec chassis either. But at the same time, you pointed it out yourself: "It does work for the first few years while everyone is still learning the car..." The GP2 formula works. There's passing. There's excitement. It tends not to be a procession, as The Danica claimed about road course racing. I'm getting ready to watch the last GP2 race on my DVR in a few minutes. I suspect that I'll see there what I seldom see in IRL races these days: drivers going balls to the wall and putting on a great show.
But like I said, I have no idea what the IRL could or should do at this point. And Penske knew for years when PM/Marlboro was going to exit. He couldn't have predicted this deep recession, but the point still remains that his is the most successful name in AOWR. Would he have had the same problem finding a primary for his NASCAR teams (minus Hornish)? I doubt it. Williams GP has already announced that it is on track to have sponsorship set for 2011. So a mid-pack F1 team, in an environment at least as bad as that here in the U.S., has already got 2011 set... but Mr. Indy Car might have to write Helio on the side of one of his cars? A successful businessman like Penske doesn't just get caught with his pants down like that.
So what's THE answer? Hey, they could try what is being suggested here: open up the rules and see what happens. I don't know for sure what the result would be. But I do know that they are running out of chances to get it right. National, local Indy 500 TV ratings take dive A 3.6 final???!!! As bad as I expected things to get years ago, I never thought I'd see the Indy 500 getting a 3.6 TV rating. Another drop like this next year, and the Indy 500 will be getting about what the Long Beach Grand Prix was getting in the 90's. If someone hasn't done it already, it is definitely time to hit the panic button."Every generation's memory is exactly as long as its own experience." --John Kenneth Galbraith
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5th June 2010, 23:43 #57
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Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
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5th June 2010, 23:50 #58
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I think Dario will stay put for a couple years. Dixon won't leave, he's finished 2,1,2 in points the last 3 years. However, I do expect Graham Rahal to race a 3rd Ganassi entry. Briscoe is gone, Sam Hornish is not working in NASCAR and will be a nice replacement.
Kyle Busch #18 M&M's Toyota Camry
Dario Franchitti #10 Target Honda Dallara DW12
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5th June 2010, 23:53 #59
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I think comparing Indycar to a development series like GP2 is not fair. If Gp2 had teams like Penske and Ganassi that spent twice as much as all the rest and hire the best, most experienced drivers, then GP2 wouldn't be as spectacular as it is now.
In GP2 you see all ride-buyers and all young, talented and slightly reckless drivers. In Indycar the race between the ridebuyer teams is just as exciting as GP2 imo. But sadly you never see that because Penske and Ganassi and Danica take 90% of the airtime and all the glory.
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6th June 2010, 00:25 #60
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Originally Posted by px400rracing-reference.info/showblog?id=1785
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