Citroen WRT vs Ford WRT

[Halvis]

For sure PG is a bonus if he gets a WRCar. I think Stobart wants a britsh driver so Meeke or Wilks is the best choice to replace Matthew for 2011.
I hope PG will take over the sponsers from H. Solberg otherwise the sponsers are insane, H. Solberg is a nice person and good for the show but not enough speed. It's time for action at the front, battles to the end!

Henning has been utterly disappointing this year (and also most of last year) - he was actually "much" faster in the Pug! Little (=none) testing, a new codriver - but still he should have been faster!

[Langdale Forest]

Prehaps Chris Atkinson could replace Henning Solberg.

[jonas_mcrae]

Rubbish, both companies have been loosing money for ages!! But right now ford is the best positioned!

PSA Citroen is actually doing good thanks to the French government and all the money and protectionist measures they have applied to protect the company. Citroen HAS to be 100% french, its almost like a national team! supported with taxpayer money! thats why they are getting Ogier ready, and so to make a 100% french lineup!

About ford, true, they were loosing money for a long time, but right now the company is doing quite well, specially in America. The involvement of ford in rally america is quite encouraging, maybe it can lead to more budget being pumped into FWRT.

However the big difference here is that Ford had no government support and that is why right now it wont invest more in rallying!!

And that is NOT basic economics its basic finance and accounting

Citroen mother company is making money - they can invest to rally. Ford mother company has been losing money since 1980 or something - they cannot invest as much. That's the difference. It's basic economics, when company is doing poorly, they reduce spending on marketing, like sponsoring a rally team.

[Woodeye]

And that is NOT basic economics its basic finance and accounting

Sure it is. You are saying that it's not fair that PSA is supported by government while Ford is not. Boohoo. PSA is still in better financial shape than Ford is. And wasn't it the US government helping all 3 big US companies when they were on verge of bankrupt.

To be honest I can't claim to know their below the line results well enough to make deep analysis about their situation. For me it just seems that Citroen is putting more money to WRC than Ford. With the help of Red Bull of course.

[Bobcat]

Citroen mother company is making money - they can invest to rally. Ford mother company has been losing money since 1980 or something - they cannot invest as much. That's the difference. It's basic economics, when company is doing poorly, they reduce spending on marketing, like sponsoring a rally team.

Oh come on! What an absurd thing to say! Ford becomes top-selling brand in Europe... http://freep.com/article/20100415/BU...rand-in-Europe

or Ford beats VW, takes No. 1 spot in Europe... http://freep.com/article/20100416/BU...spot-in-Europe

[serial jeff]

Sure it is. You are saying that it's not fair that PSA is supported by government while Ford is not. Boohoo. PSA is still in better financial shape than Ford is. And wasn't it the US government helping all 3 big US companies when they were on verge of bankrupt.

To be honest I can't claim to know their below the line results well enough to make deep analysis about their situation. For me it just seems that Citroen is putting more money to WRC than Ford. With the help of Red Bull of course.

I don't know much about Ford's finances either, but I do know that they received nothing from the government. The American government gave literally billions of dollars to GM and Chrysler, while Ford received nothing because they were considered to be doing okay.

[noel157]

I don't know much about Ford's finances either, but I do know that they received nothing from the government. The American government gave literally billions of dollars to GM and Chrysler, while Ford received nothing because they were considered to be doing okay.

Ford US did manage to force themselves to take a 6 billion dollar soft loan from the US Treasury last year to help improve fuel efficiency in future models and to pay for better production methods.
The company will also receive further funds this year and throughout 2011.

[Bobcat]

The American government gave literally billions of dollars to GM and Chrysler, while Ford received nothing because they were considered to be doing okay.

Well done!

Isn't Ford the hot automaker on a roll, gaining sales, posting profits, riding the goodwill of a nation for avoiding federal life support and sporting a stock price that's tripled in the past year?

And isn't GM the much-derided Government Motors, 61% owned by Uncle Sam, shrunken from eight to four brands in a bankruptcy that wiped out the Old GM shareholders, and still losing money as of its latest financial report a week ago?
True on both counts... says DFP.

[RS]

Oh come on! What an absurd thing to say! Ford becomes top-selling brand in Europe... http://freep.com/article/20100415/BU...rand-in-Europe

or Ford beats VW, takes No. 1 spot in Europe... http://freep.com/article/20100416/BU...spot-in-Europe

There is a difference between sales and profit....

Other points related to the discussion in this thread;

- I am sure Stobart get a "special discount" for running Matty instead of another driver.

- It does seem the Ford isn't up to the standard of the Citroen this year, but I also think the Fiesta will need to be faster than the DS3 if Loeb is going to be beaten.

[Bobcat]

Ford US did manage to force themselves to take a 6 billion dollar soft loan from the US Treasury last year to help improve fuel efficiency in future models and to pay for better production methods.
The company will also receive further funds this year and throughout 2011.

That is so not true! Tesla, Ford and Nissan win big with DOE grants... http://revengeoftheelectriccar.com/t...th-doe-grants/