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17th March 2009, 23:56 #11
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Put another way, in 1952 and 1953 Ascari won every Championship GP he started except for France and Italy in 1953.
Indianapolis is an irrelevance - when the World Drivers' Championship was inaugurated the Americans quite rightly said that it couldn't be termed a 'World' championship without the world's greatest race. (Incidentally when Formula 1 was introduced in 1947, the organisers tried to change the Indianapolis rules to make the race compliant but under pressure from the runners of 3-litre supercharged cars, principally the Novis, they stayed with what they had that was essentially the 1938 Grand Prix rules).
And please, don't use F1 as shorthand for World Championship - they are not the same thing. Remember it has only been named the "FIA Formula 1 World Championship" since 1982. There were 30 years of World Championship history before then!Duncan Rollo
The more you learn, the more you realise how little you know.
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18th March 2009, 16:55 #12
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The record is correct - because he didn't enter the Indy 500 - therefore he won 9 races out of 9 that he entered in succession. Had he entered the Indy 500 and not won then that would have been a different story.
Niente è vero, tutto è permesso
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18th March 2009, 18:27 #13
Ascari`s achievements in 52-53 are amazing! but sadly not a record. The WDC records would show the indy500 breaking up ascaris fine run of success, so even though he won 9 times from 9 starts, thats NOT the same as winning 9 consecutive world championship events.
One strange thing from this period is the WDC being run to F2 regs + indy 500.The F2 regs were used because of a lack of competitive F1 machinery after Alfa`s withdrawal at the end of 1951, leaving Ferrari the only competitve F1 team ( the theortically faster BRM V16 being woefully unreliable at this time). So, to improve the competition the wdc was run to F2 regs - which Ferrari completely dominated! So, management meddling didnt work in the 50`s either!
Plus ca change, plus ca mem chose!
or something
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19th March 2009, 01:51 #14
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I have alway considered Ascari's string to be the record, perhaps Grand Prix wins, if we have to be picky. 9 GP wins in a row, over a years's period is no snall feat. It is about the only record that M. Schumacher does not own.
In the early 1950s, it was almost impossible to compete at Indy and carry on a full European program. Ascari did enter the 1952 Indy, qualifying an ill-suited Ferrari 19th, and dropping out early with a broken wheel. He won much praise from the Americans for his smooth precise style. He paved the way for later attempts by Brabham and Clark. Had he entered the Swiss GP, instead of Indy, his record could have been 10 consecutive victories.
It would be 10 years from Ascari's time before Indy and F1 could be tackled in the same season. Jim Clark is the only driver to win at Indy and F1 in the same season; in 1965 he won 6 F1 races plus Indy and even then had to skip Monaco.
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19th March 2009, 02:34 #15
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He did enter the Indy 500 one year (I think it was '53) and he finished 32nd after a wheel problem.
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19th March 2009, 07:31 #16
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Originally Posted by woody2goody
He is the only European race at Indy as part of the World ChampionshipI got my motorcycle jacket, but I'm walking all the time...
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19th March 2009, 21:59 #17
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As Blito said the regs at the time were run as F2 which meant that the competition wasn't as tough (as there wasn't an abundance of cars) and also that the cars weren't F1 cars! Ascari is a strange one, nobody ever rates him as one of the best of all time despite his 2 championships, the only thing people remember him for was going for a swin at Monaco in 1955!
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19th March 2009, 23:25 #18
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Most knowledgeable observers do list Ascari as one of the top drivers ever, Motorsport listed him as #16 for 20th century pilots and this included the pre war aces ( Nuvolari was 1).
In the early 50s he was considered on a par with Fangio, even quicker on certain days.
The decision to run the 1952-53 World Championship to F2 regulations should in no way detract from the results. If the current crop of F1 drivers were to race in GP2 cars, the competition would be just as fierce, maybe better. There were a host of F2 cars available, judging by the grids. Ferrari was dominant winning every race but one, but Maserati did field competitive cars in those days. Ascari still had to race teamates Farina,Taruffi and Villoresi. Fangio missed 1952 due to an injury but he was competitive in 53 for Maserati.
Any driver can only race against the field and Ascari took on all comers for over a year without defeat. He truly deserves a top ranking for F1 drivers, all time.
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20th March 2009, 00:15 #19
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Originally Posted by ChrisSFan of Timo Glock and proud of it! :champion: 3 podiums, new start as a Virgin :p
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20th March 2009, 01:36 #20
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There were plenty of non-championship F1/F2 races in 1952-53, and Ascari won 6 of them. This gives more indication that he was the man to beat over this period.
Fourmaux. Btw msport tested also hankook tyres https://youtu.be/DESKqpAqX5o?si=3uxWc8FrCUGMT0Pi https://youtu.be/sHetcbBQwKk?si=M7kq3bf2ar3Slhco
WRC Testing