Rally History (part III)

**sednem** · 16th Nov 11, 09:28

Originally Posted by harriswrc

I don't think that Kostas Tanoussis was driving this period. We was a kid :-)
The drives is most likely his father, Zois Tanoussis.

Thanks Harris...

But you know, some great champions started very early...

BTW do you have birth dates for those drivers???

Best regards
Américo.

**stanislav197** · 16th Nov 11, 11:11

Thanks,Americo.Help me for results - ERC - 1979 :1/Janer - 8 and 10 th ;5/Costa Brava - 8-9 th ;8/Targa Florio - 10 th ;10/Costa Smeralda - 8 th ;14/Firestone - 7-9 th ;15/ARBO - 7-10 th ;17/Lucien Bianchi - 5,6,8 th ;18/Alpin - 10 th ;20/4 Regioni - 9-10 th ;21/Lorainne - 6-10 th ;24/Hesen - 8,10 th ;26/Donegal - 8,10 th ;27/Ourense - 7-10 th ;28/Del Ciocco - 9 th ;29/Ypres - 7 th ;30/Skoda - 10 th ;33/Danube - 9 th ;34/Taurus - 5-7 th ;36/Halkidikis - 8-9 th ;39/Tour de France - 9 th ;40/Du Vins - 2-6 th and 8-10 th ;41/Cyprus - 10 th ;43/OASC - 5 and 9 th ;44/De la Châtaigne - 3,8 th ;45/RACE - 6 th .

**harriswrc** · 16th Nov 11, 22:18

Originally Posted by sednem

Thanks Harris...

But you know, some great champions started very early...

BTW do you have birth dates for those drivers???

Best regards
Américo.

Unfortunately I have not birth dates for these drivers.
But I will look for them ;-)

**D-Type** · 16th Nov 11, 22:59

Originally Posted by D-Type

On another forum someone is asking:
"Does anybody have an entry list for the 1964 Circuit of Ireland?"
and (curiously)
"Does anybody know who drove the Aston Martin DB4 course car?"

If you can help please PM me - or post the info here.

The Clerk of the Course driving the DB4 was Robin McKinney.

I'm surprised nobody has an entry list?

**Steve Boyd** · 17th Nov 11, 16:27

Originally Posted by stanislav197

Steve,Help me for Rally Manx result and dates :1974- 1-10 th ;1973-1-10 th ;1967 - 1-10 th ;1965- 1-10 th ;1964 - 1-10 th ;1963 - 1-10 th .

Again from "25 Years of the Manx Rally" by Doug Baird & Gordon Kniveton:

1963, start & finish Douglas, IoM
1. Reg McBride/Don Barrow (Allardette) 57 Marks
2. Phil Simister/B. Potts (Allardette) 65 Marks
3. John Sprinzel/W. Cave (Allardette) 70 Marks
4. Geoff Allen/B. Hughes (Vauxhall VX 4/90) 70 Marks
5. F. Grange/J. Middleton (Allardette) 74 marks
6. Tony Fisher/John Brown (850 Mini) 77 Marks
7. Roy Dixon/D. Ralphs (Anglia Super) 78 Marks
8. Brian Culcheth/John Davenport (Sebring Sprite) 86 Marks
9. D. Sisson/R. Etheridge (Triumph TR4) 90 Marks
10. Roger Clark/H. Patton (Mini Cooper) 94 Marks

1964, start & finish Douglas, IoM
1. David Friswell/Keith Binns (1275 Cooper S) 853 points
2. Barrie Williams/Mike Lindsay-Jones (1071 Cooper S) 856 points
3. Norman Birkett/Pat Hauseman (Ford Cortina GT) 1007 points
4. John Sprinzel/"Fred" (Ford Cortina GT) 1024 points
5. Frank Grange/Barrie Potts (Ford Cortina) 1029 points
6. Phil Simister/Graham Robson (Ford Cortina) 1053 points
7. Horace Saville/John Dodsworth (1071 Cooper S) 1075 points
8. K. Watkinson/D. Watkinson (MGA Twin Cam) 1076 points
9. Mike Offley/Terry Harrison (Mini) 1116 points
10. Don Grimshaw/Tony Mason (Triumph TR4) 1131 points

1965 (May 21-23), start & finish Douglas, IoM
1. Tony Fall/David Fawcett (1275 Cooper S) 619 points
2. Chris Knowles-Fitton/Mike Wood (1275 Cooper S) 680 points
3. Don Lindsay/Ray Kennedy (1275 Minivan) 751 points
4. Dennis Easthope/Denis Craine (1275 Cooper S) 759 points
5. Martin Clark/Paul Stephens (Ford Cortina GT) 772 points
6. John Dodsworth/Adrian Hundleby (1275 Cooper S) 779 points
7. Mike Offley/Terry Harrison (970 Cooper S) 802 points
8. P. Green/? (MGB) 904 points
9. Cec Offley/Rob Lyall (997 Mini Cooper) 915 points
10. Ken Leece/Evelyn Leece (1275 Cooper S) 918 points

1967 (May 19-21), start & finish Douglas, IoM
1. Norman Harvey/Terry Vaux (1275 Mini Cooper S) 917 points
2. Ken Leece/Evelyn Leece (1275 Mini Cooper S) 955 points
3. John Huyton/Bob Corrin (Ford Cortina GT) 1054 points
4. Richard Hill/Norman Salt (Lotus Cortina) 1123 points
5. P. Marshall/T. Cork (Ford Cortina GT) 1226 points
6. C. Twigdon/T. Williams (1275 Mini Cooper S) 1437 points
7. Rodney Goodchild/John Hague (1275 Mini Cooper S) 1440 points
8. Haydn Minay/Miss Christine Leece (1275 Mini Cooper S) 1537 points
9. Edward Christian/Mike Kennish (Ford Anglia) 1546 points
10. Brian Denny/P. Walker (1275 Mini Cooper S) 1571 points

1973, start & finish Douglas, IoM
1. Adrian Boyd/John Davenport (Ford Escort RS) 169 points
2. Cahal Curley/Austin Frazer (Porsche Carrera RS) 209 points
3. Dennis Easthope/Bernie Magee (Ford Escort RS) 634 points
4. Dessie McCartney/Drexel Gillespie (Porsche Carrera) 686 points
5. Malcolm Patrick/Roger Rhoderick-Jones ((Porsche Carrera) 704 points
6. Pat Moss-Carlsson/Liz Crellin (Renault Alpine) 858 points
7. Will Sparrow/Nigel Raeburn (Vauxhall Firenza) 906 points
8. Tony Fowkes/Bryan Harris (Ford Escort RS) 962 points
9. Barry Lee/Howard Scott (Ford Escort RS) 1076 points
10. John Dodsworth/Stuart Comish (Ford Escort TC) 1188 points

1974 (September 13-15), start & finish Douglas, IoM
1. Cahal Curley/Austin Frazer (Porsche Carrera) 1031 points
2. Dessie McCartney/Terry Harryman (Porsche Carrera) 1156 points
3. Roger Clark/Jim Porter (Escort 2-litre BDA) 1284 points
4. Billy Coleman/Peter Scott (Escort 2-litre BDA) 1437 points
5. Nigel Rockey/Paul White (Escort 2-litre BDA) 1628 points
6. Tony Pond/Frances Cobb (Opel Ascona) 1644 points
7. Adrian Boyd/Frank Main (Escort 1800 BDA) 1743 points
8. Brian Nelson/Fred Gallagher (BMW 2002Tii) 1762 points
9. Russel Brookes/John Brown (Escort RS2000) 1834 points
10. Chris Beynon/Lyn Andrews (Porsche Carrera) 1843 points

**Steve Boyd** · 17th Nov 11, 16:35

Originally Posted by sednem

Hi Steve...

Here what I have for Manx 88...
1988 - 26º Tudor Webasto Manx International Rally
1. #2 Patrick Snijers (BEL)/Dany Colebunders (BEL) - BMW M3 - 3H30:38
2. #1 Jimmy McRae (GBR)/Rob Arthur (GBR) - R.E.D. / Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 0:21
3. #??? Phil Collins (GBR)/Bryan Thomas (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 6:36
4. #3 Fabrizio Tabaton (ITA)/Luciano Tedeschini (ITA) - H.F. Grifone / Lancia Delta Integrale - + 7:46
5. #6 Malcolm Wilson (GBR)/Ian Grindrod (GBR) - GM Dealersport / Vauxhall Astra GT/E - + 8:55
6. #7 Pentti Airikkala (FIN)/Ronan McNamee (GBR) - Mitsubishi Starion Turbo - + 9:51
7. #??? Louise Aitken-Walker (GBR)/Ellen Morgan (GBR) - Peugeot Talbot Sport / Peugeot 205 Gti - + 13:18
8. #??? Chris Birkbeck (GBR)/Trevor Godden (GBR) - GM Dealersport / Vauxhall Astra GT/E - + 14:58
9. #??? Simon Davison (GBR)/Steve Bond (GBR) - Volkswagen Golf GTi 16v - + 15:47
10. #??? Ian Tilke (GBR)/??? Wray (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 17:02

If you want 89 and 90 I have those too..
Since I have (all most) all of top 10 ERC, now I'm trying to retrieve all the other results for rallys that have at least 1 ERC event...
Huge work... so for sure i'll need Manx 63->75 and 97->now...
When I'll reach "Great Britain" (I'm now at France...) I'll be back to you... Thanks in advance!

Best Regards
Américo

Thanks Américo - 89 & 90 would be good.
We now have Ian Wray as co-driver for Ian Tilke in 10th place 1988, thanks to Martin, and I can give you the dates: September 15-17
Just post on here when you are ready for more & I will pass on what I have.

**sednem** · 26th Nov 11, 09:15

Originally Posted by Steve Boyd

Thanks Américo - 89 & 90 would be good.
We now have Ian Wray as co-driver for Ian Tilke in 10th place 1988, thanks to Martin, and I can give you the dates: September 15-17
Just post on here when you are ready for more & I will pass on what I have.

Here's what I have for 89 an 90...

1989 - 27º Rally Internacional Ilha de Man
1. #12 Russell Brookes (GBR)/Neil Wilson (GBR) - Andrews Sykes Ford Champions Team / Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - 3H42:10
2. #11 Mark Lovell (GBR)/Ronan Morgan (IRL) - Andrews Sykes Ford Champions Team / Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 0:19
3. #2 Jimmy McRae (GBR)/Rob Arthur (GBR) - R.E.D. / Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 2:13
4. #19 Dave Metcalfe (GBR)/Nicky Grist (GBR) - Vauxhall DT / Vauxhall Nova GT/E - + 12:40
5. #16 Louise Aitken-Walker (GBR)/Ellen Morgan (GBR) - Vauxhall DT / Vauxhall Astra GT/E - + 13:47
6. #15 Austin MacHale (IRL)/Brian Murphy (IRL) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 14:32
7. #??? Kenny McKinstry (IRL)/Robert Philpott (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 19:24
8. #18 Andrew Wood (GBR)/David Paterson (GBR) - Audi 90 Quattro - + 20:23
9. #8 Hakan Ericsson (SWE)/Johnny Johansson (SWE) - Peugeot Talbot Sport / Peugeot 309 Gti - + 20:31
10. #17 Chris Birkbeck (GBR)/Mike Kidd (GBR) - Peugeot 205 Gti - + 26:28

1990 - 28º Rally Internacional Ilha de Man
1. #3 Russell Brookes (GBR)/Neil Wilson (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - 3H42:21
2. #19 Bertie Fisher (IRL)/Rory Kennedy (IRL) - BMW M3 - + 0:45
3. #4 Colin McRae (GBR)/Derek Ringer (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 1:05
4. #14 James Cullen (GBR)/Ellen Morgan (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 1:27
5. #7 Graham Middleton (GBR)/Paul Watkins (GBR) - BMW M3 - + 6:22
6. #2 Sepp Haider (AUT)/Peter Diekmann (DEU) - GM Euro Sport / Opel Kadett Gsi 16v - + 7:33
7. #15 Chris Birkbeck (GBR)/Steve Harris (GBR) - Vauxhall Astra GT/E - + 7:57
8. #23 Ramón Ferreyros (PER)/Andy Moss (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 12:04
9. #16 Andrew Wood (GBR)/David Paterson (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 13:09
10. #27 Paul Frankland (GBR)/Keith Chipcase (GBR) - Peugeot Talbot Sport / Peugeot 205 Gti - + 19:34

Best regards
Américo.

**Steve Boyd** · 26th Nov 11, 14:59

Thanks Américo.
For anyone who keeps dates the 1989 Manx was September 14-16 and in 1990 September 13-15.

**januszsz** · 26th Nov 11, 14:59

Originally Posted by sednem

Here's what I have for 89 an 90...

1989 - 27º Rally Internacional Ilha de Man
7. #??? Kenny McKinstry (IRL)/Robert Philpott (GBR) - Ford Sierra RS Cosworth - + 19:24

Best regards
Américo.

Mc Kinstry's starting number was 37.

Regards
Janusz

**januszsz** · 26th Nov 11, 15:20

I am looking for some data on Eastern Europe rallies:
1967
Cordatic (H) dates, result (possibly full), start lists
1968
Pneumant (DDR) 27-30.3 result (possibly full), start lists
1969
Cordatic (H) 29-31.8 result (possibly full), start lists
Tatry-Poprad (CS) 5-7.9. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 24-26.10 result (possibly full), start lists
1970
Zlatni Piassetzi (BG) 13-14.6. result (possibly full), start lists
Cordatic (H) 28-30.8. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 22-24.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1971
Vltava (CS) dates, result (possibly full), start lists
Slovensko ZTS Nitra (CS) 11-13.9. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 19-20.11. result (possibly full), start lists
1972
Slovensko Poprad - Tatry (CS) 23-24.9. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 27-28.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1973
Cordatic (H) 31.8-1.9. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 27-28.10 result (possibly full), start lists
Russkaya Zima (SU) 14-16.12. result (possibly full), start lists
1974
Volan (H) 30-31.5. result (possibly full), start lists
Donau (RO) 1-3.8. result (possibly full), start lists
1976
Volan (H) 28-29.4. result (possibly full), start lists
Sachsenring (DDR) 9-10.9. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 21-23.10. result (possibly full), start lists
Russkaya Zima (SU) 11-15.12. result (possibly full), start lists
1978
Wartburg (DDR) 19-21.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1980
Wartburg (DDR) 23-25.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1981
Volan (H) 23-24.5. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) dates, result (possibly full), start lists
1983
Wartburg (DDR) dates, result (possibly full), start lists
Wismut (DDR) 1-2.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1984
Mogurt Salgo (H) 30.3-1.4. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 19-20.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1985
Mogurt Salgo (H) 12-14.4. result (possibly full), start lists
Tatry (CS) dates, result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 25-26.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1986
Mogurt Salgo (H) 19-20.4. result (possibly full), start lists
Donau Dacia (RO) 14-15.6. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 23-25.10. result (possibly full), start lists
1987
Donau Dacia (RO) 11-12.6. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 20-21.10. result (possibly full), start lists
Soyuz'87 (SU) dates, result (possibly full), start lists
1988
Mogurt Salgo (H) 22-24.10. result (possibly full), start lists
Old Toomas Tallin (SU) 21.5. result (possibly full), start lists
1989
Mogurt Salgo (H) 21-23.4. result (possibly full), start lists
Donau Dacia (RO) 9-11.6. result (possibly full), start lists
Wartburg (DDR) 19-21.10. result (possibly full), start lists
Sachsenring (DDR) 2-4.11. result (possibly full), start lists

Thank you in advance for your help.
Regards
Janusz

**RobertS** · 26th Nov 11, 17:43

Originally Posted by januszsz

I am looking for some data on Eastern Europe rallies:

1973
Cordatic (H) 31.8-1.9. result (possibly full), start lists

Janusz,
There was no! Cordatic rallye in 1973.
In 1973 the Taurus Rallye(31.8-1.-9.) was the Hungarian round of the CPF Championship.

Originally Posted by januszsz

1974
Volan (H) 30-31.5. result (possibly full), start lists

'74 VOLÁN rallye was Hungarian only event. I have full result if you need...

**januszsz** · 26th Nov 11, 18:09

Hi RobertS,
Thank you for correction Taurus/Cordatic and of course I need Volan'74 full result.
Regards
Janusz

**Steve Boyd** · 29th Nov 11, 22:30

Originally Posted by januszsz

Mc Kinstry's starting number was 37.

Regards
Janusz

Thanks Janusz

**anihel** · 6th Dec 11, 23:33

Originally Posted by Steve Boyd

Start numbers can be seen in the photographs linked below
Billy Coleman, Galway 1978::: Rally Retro :: by Rallyretro.com
Hugh O'Brien, Galway 1978::: Rally Retro :: by Rallyretro.com
Sean Campbell, Donegal 1978::: Rally Retro :: by Rallyretro.com
I've looked at the photographs of Noel Harvey on this site, but sadly his number isn't clear in any of them!

Noel Harvey was #29 in the 1978 Donegal International Rally

**Plan9** · 7th Dec 11, 22:49

If Subaru had stayed in the WRC for 2009 who would have been the drivers? One of them was Gronholm?

Would Guy Wilks have had a seat?

Any help is appreciated; I am not sure if the year 2009 is "historic" enough =p

**Steve Boyd** · 8th Dec 11, 00:44

Originally Posted by anihel

Noel Harvey was #29 in the 1978 Donegal International Rally

Thanks Kevin

**anihel** · 8th Dec 11, 01:26

No problem Steve, been off these forums for a few years, so I hope I can answer any Irish (and maybe some British) related questions through the Rallyretro connection!

**D-Type** · 8th Dec 11, 14:21

Originally Posted by Plan9

If Subaru had stayed in the WRC for 2009 who would have been the drivers? One of them was Gronholm?

Would Guy Wilks have had a seat?

Any help is appreciated; I am not sure if the year 2009 is "historic" enough =p

The basic rule I use is if the topic involves drivers still competing then it isn't historic yet. But that really applies to discussions not a simple question like this.
What you could have done (and I'm not saying do it retrospectively) is open a new thread and flag it as history - then it appears in both bulletin boards.

While I'm on, I feel that this thread is getting very long and unwieldy. Should we close it and start a series of threads on the history ofndividual rallies or series. What do people think?

**Martin Liddle** · 11th Dec 11, 13:47

Originally Posted by D-Type

While I'm on, I feel that this thread is getting very long and unwieldy. Should we close it and start a series of threads on the history of individual rallies or series. What do people think?

The posting volume on average is not high and having it in one thread has the advantage of only needing to check a single thread on the relatively infrequent times I drop in. If you split it there could be a vast numbrt of threads, most with very few posts.

**Steve Boyd** · 11th Dec 11, 17:47

I agree. It's easy to drop in every so often and learn some interesting facts, make the odd contribution and perhaps re-kindle memories. If you try to divide it up into events it becomes difficult to know where to put championship queries. If it's divided into championships where do you put a question about one event over a number of years. As Martin says you would finish up with a lot of short threads as each new question would almost certainly have to start a new thread of its own.