Felipe Massa

**pino** · 21st May 12, 16:41

Originally Posted by Bagwan

I wouldn't be too sure about that , Pino .

I guess the obvious question for you is , why should they keep him ?

Probably because except for Trulli...there isn't a better driver available at the moment

**SGWilko** · 21st May 12, 16:49

Originally Posted by pino

Probably because except for Trulli...there isn't a better driver available at the moment

Oh no - don't start a Trulli v Villeneuve 'best No. 2 driver' fight......

**pino** · 21st May 12, 16:51

Originally Posted by SGWilko

Oh no - don't start a Trulli v Villeneuve 'best No. 2 driver' fight......

Actually if I were Luca I would sign both of them

**SGWilko** · 21st May 12, 16:53

Originally Posted by pino

Actually if I were Luca I would sign both of them

And pay Santander to not have Alonso in the car???

**pino** · 21st May 12, 17:00

Originally Posted by SGWilko

And pay Santander to not have Alonso in the car???

I would probably talk to my Bank and do that

**Bagwan** · 21st May 12, 17:31

Originally Posted by pino

Probably because except for Trulli...there isn't a better driver available at the moment

Either Jacques or Jarno will do , and both would be even better .

But what do you think Luca was intimating with the "must" quote , but that he must improve , or else ?

**pino** · 21st May 12, 18:18

Originally Posted by Bagwan

Either Jacques or Jarno will do , and both would be even better .

But what do you think Luca was intimating with the "must" quote , but that he must improve , or else ?

Exactly, Massa must just improve his performances that's all. As I don't have the video interview I can't judge the tone of his voice so nothing else for now...

**Bagwan** · 21st May 12, 19:25

Originally Posted by pino

Exactly, Massa must just improve his performances that's all. As I don't have the video interview I can't judge the tone of his voice so nothing else for now...

I see .
It seems the tone of Luca's voice might see you change your mind about how long wee Felipe may stay .

For having reminded us often that he would be there until the end of the year , it doesn't seem you're so sure after all .

**pino** · 21st May 12, 20:17

Originally Posted by Bagwan

I see .
It seems the tone of Luca's voice might see you change your mind about how long wee Felipe may stay .

For having reminded us often that he would be there until the end of the year , it doesn't seem you're so sure after all .

I am still sure Massa will stay until the end of the season...Luca might not

**Bagwan** · 21st May 12, 21:18

Originally Posted by pino

I am still sure Massa will stay until the end of the season...Luca might not

Cagey answer .

"Staying" doesn't necessarily mean "driving" , does it ? .

The "must" was regarding Massa'a performance , not Luca's .
Besides , Luca already has the best job in Italy .
He'll go nowhere ; nowhere but the secret red telephone booth hotline to Jarno's winery .

**SGWilko** · 22nd May 12, 10:13

Originally Posted by Bagwan

I see .
It seems the tone of Luca's voice might see you change your mind about how long wee Felipe may stay .

For having reminded us often that he would be there until the end of the year , it doesn't seem you're so sure after all .

The point is, Ferrari know full well how badly it can go changing drivers mid season - once bitten and all that. They would HAVE to put a driver in their car that has racing knowledge of the 2012 tyres as well as the current Ferrari.

Facing facts, bar having a grumble in the press, there is little that can be done this year.

**pino** · 22nd May 12, 12:55

Originally Posted by SGWilko

The point is, Ferrari know full well how badly it can go changing drivers mid season - once bitten and all that. They would HAVE to put a driver in their car that has racing knowledge of the 2012 tyres as well as the current Ferrari.

Facing facts, bar having a grumble in the press, there is little that can be done this year.

Bingo !

**Bagwan** · 22nd May 12, 13:12

Originally Posted by SGWilko

The point is, Ferrari know full well how badly it can go changing drivers mid season - once bitten and all that. They would HAVE to put a driver in their car that has racing knowledge of the 2012 tyres as well as the current Ferrari.

Facing facts, bar having a grumble in the press, there is little that can be done this year.

How much worse can it get , though , as Felipe baby has earned on average , less than a point per race ?
And , this is while the same car in the hands of his team-mate , is equal first in the standings .

Maybe Massa still has it , and it's just that the car doesn't suit him . It wouldn't be the first time someone had a hard time driving Alonso's car .
Whatever the reason , he's become someone they cannot count on to be anywhere near the front , and that's a problem .

And , there are a few guys out there who would relish the chance to show they are no Fish .

**Hawkmoon** · 23rd May 12, 03:24

Originally Posted by SGWilko

They would HAVE to put a driver in their car that has racing knowledge of the 2012 tyres as well as the current Ferrari.

I'm not so sure. Raikkonen was out of the sport for two years, had no experience with either the car or the tyres and has done rather well. It is possible for a driver to get up to speed quickly. Sure Raikkonen is more talented than anybody currently available and had winter testing to get familiar with the car and tyres but Ferrari aren't looking for a driver to come in and contend for the title. They're simply looking for an upgrade over Massa which will be pretty easy to achieve. All the driver has to do is score 4 points in 5 races and he'll have delivered double Massa's return so far this year.

Ferrari can give a new driver time to learn because Massa has set such a low benchmark so far.

**SGWilko** · 23rd May 12, 11:30

Originally Posted by Hawkmoon

I'm not so sure. Raikkonen was out of the sport for two years, had no experience with either the car or the tyres and has done rather well. It is possible for a driver to get up to speed quickly. Sure Raikkonen is more talented than anybody currently available and had winter testing to get familiar with the car and tyres but Ferrari aren't looking for a driver to come in and contend for the title. They're simply looking for an upgrade over Massa which will be pretty easy to achieve. All the driver has to do is score 4 points in 5 races and he'll have delivered double Massa's return so far this year.

Ferrari can give a new driver time to learn because Massa has set such a low benchmark so far.

Yes, but with new rules and new for 2012 tyres he had the same amount of prep as the other drivers.

**Hawkmoon** · 23rd May 12, 13:03

Originally Posted by SGWilko

Yes, but with new rules and new for 2012 tyres he had the same amount of prep as the other drivers.

True, but Ferrari can give a driver 5 races to get up to speed and only need a single 9th place to equal Massa's tally. Anything more than that is a bonus. Massa has set such a low benchmark that his replacement only needs to get into Q3 and finish at the bottom of the top 10 to be an improvement.

Ferrari really don't have much to lose by replacing the Brazilian.

**Bezza** · 23rd May 12, 16:47

I think personally Felipe Massa has one, maybe two, races left to prove himself. He is on a “final warning” now I believe, and any more poor races like the four of the first five, and I think Ferrari will sideline him.

There are three drivers available who I believe will do a better job than Massa, and will be happy to drive for Ferrari for a fraction of the what a fully signed up driver will pay for. These drivers are:

Adrian Sutil
Jarno Trulli
Jaime Alguersuari

All with recent experience and with good speed in inferior cars. A contract for them until the end of 2012 would be beneficial for everybody.

I believe Massa has zero confidence now, and will effectively be forced into retirement once Ferrari release him, his reputation has been battered by Alonso’s superiority.

My personal prediction?

Massa to crash in Monaco, finish out of the points in Canada and be replaced thereafter by…..

JARNO TRULLI !!!

**Garry Walker** · 23rd May 12, 19:05

Originally Posted by Bezza

I think personally Felipe Massa has one, maybe two, races left to prove himself. He is on a “final warning” now I believe, and any more poor races like the four of the first five, and I think Ferrari will sideline him.

There are three drivers available who I believe will do a better job than Massa, and will be happy to drive for Ferrari for a fraction of the what a fully signed up driver will pay for. These drivers are:

Adrian Sutil
Jarno Trulli
Jaime Alguersuari

The Slasher? Why would Ferrari hire someone like him after his stupid actions? From talent point of view he deserves a seat, but based on what he did, he deserves no seat in F1 ever again.
Trulli? The guy who was fired in favour of Petrov? No way, he is just too old and his performances against Kovalainen were not too good. So no way Ferrari will hire him, espescially seeing what happened with Fisi.
Alguersuari? What has he ever done in F1? Nothing. Replacing a race winner with a guy who has done nothing would make Ferrari look stupid.

I agree that Massa is really not up to it at the moment. Sadly, his career was destroyed by the accident at Hungary and being a nr.2 driver ti Alonso means that he, as a driver who more than most needs mental support from his team to perform, is nowhere near the driver he was a couple of seasons ago. He will not get a contract from Ferrari for 2013 and the indications are that probably his career will be over with after this year. But replacing him is just nonsense, Ferrari doesn't have anyone to replace him with. That isn't to say Ferrari won't take a gamble on someone like Perez, but the guys you mentioned in my view are not deserving of the seat and Ferrari will not consider them.

**Knock-on** · 23rd May 12, 22:59

Gazza. Ferrari have opted for a Donkey before: remember....

However, I think you may be right and it unlikely that either of those three will replace him (not if, but when).

As for all this namby, pamby crap about the accident. Clutching at straws. He has always been fragile even if he's a nice bloke. Rob cannot polish a turd and the only thing Massa can do now is to destroy other peoples races as he's encouraged to do.

**tfp** · 23rd May 12, 23:38

Maybe the thread should be renamed "who should replace massa"

Cant see any of the three mentioned above being any good, Sutil for stupid behaviour off the track, Trulli because his performance was lacking against Heikki (But I must admit I think heikki is by far and away the best of the back runners) and Jaime diddnt really set the world on fire. My opinion? I think they could do a lot worse than Rubens! Or maybe Perez?